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KmiKzee

The real problem of PokeMMO's economy.

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74 members have voted

  1. 1. Who is responsible of lowering item's prices in PokeMMO?

    • People that lower prices.
      59
    • People who sell stacks of 99.
      15


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Okay, in this post I will explain which is the real problem with PokeMMO's economy.  Here we go.

 

The problem with GTL aren't persons that sells at a lower price, the real problem with this are persons who sells stacks of 99. I will explain it:

 

We will work with one item, Everstone. Evertone's price is 8k aprox. Now, supose that one person, called "A", is selling 10 Everstones at 8k, and A is the lower price. Most of people think that earning money fast is better than have to wait some hours (I am not here to tell you if that is okay or not, come on, if you could you will want to earn 1m in 1 hour, right?), so one of them, called "B", will sell his 10 Everstones at 7999y, so here is when the price of Everstone starts to fall. But he is offering just 10 Everstones , so Everstone's price will not get stuck (7999y it is a temporal price because of the low quantity of Everstones B is selling and they will be sold fast).

 

Okay so, wich is the real problem?

 

The real problem are persons who sells in stacks of 99 Everstones. Why? Supose that another person called "C"  sales an stack of 99 Everstones at 8k. As I have said previously, most of people think that earning monet fast is better than have to wait some time, so another person called "D" will sell another stack of 99 Everstones at 7800y because he doesn't want to wait 1 hour or 2 hours until the Everstones are sold. Here is when the price get stuck. They won't sell it fast, so the price will be stuck for a time between 7.8k and 8k. Here is when another one comes and sells another stack of 99 Everstones at a lower price, so he will stuck more it's price.

 

In conclusion.

 

The real problem is not that item's price goes down, the real problem are people who sell stacks or a big amount of items at the same time. It's obviously we cant stop people who sell items at lower prices, but we can stop people who sell stacks of items.If we do this, the prices won't get stuck.

Maybe a quantity or time restriction to sell some items will stop this, it can be different for each one of not (because is more easy farm some items than others).

 

I would like you to tell me what you think about this. Wich is economy's problem for you? How would you solve it?

 

See ya.

-Kmikzee.

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Even though I disagree with people who undercut the lowest market price by anything more than $1 (Seriously, what's the point? You're the lowest price whether you list at $1 less or $200 less, which means your listings will sell faster than everyone else's. You're robbing both yourself and other vendors profit by undercutting a lot), there's nothing anyone can do about it. It's a free market and players are the ones who control it. If restrictions are placed it's no longer a free market or a simulated economy. So uh, we either suck it up or buy the market out and re-list the items at a higher price.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, KmiKzee said:

The real problem are persons who sells in stacks of 99 Everstones. Why? Supose that another person called "C"  sales an stack of 99 Everstones at 8k. As I have said previously, most of people think that earning monet fast is better than have to wait some time, so another person called "D" will sell another stack of 99 Everstones at 7800y because he doesn't want to wait 1 hour or 2 hours until the Everstones are sold. Here is when the price get stuck. They won't sell it fast, so the price will be stuck for a time between 7.8k and 8k. Here is when another one comes and sells another stack of 99 Everstones at a lower price, so he will stuck more it's price.

The exact same thing would happen if this person lists 1 everstone 99 times in a row though. What you are essentially describing here is constant undercutting, this is due to a) How GTL interface is designed - you can see every single listing and it's specific information as well, and unless you fundamentally change the interface undercutting will always be a thing; and b) Liquidity issues - this is where supply and demand comes in place, if there is a bigger supply, people lower their prices to meet the demand in order to increase liquidity.

2 hours ago, KmiKzee said:

The real problem is not that item's price goes down, the real problem are people who sell stacks or a big amount of items at the same time. It's obviously we cant stop people who sell items at lower prices, but we can stop people who sell stacks of items.If we do this, the prices won't get stuck.

Maybe a quantity or time restriction to sell some items will stop this, it can be different for each one of not (because is more easy farm some items than others).

Personally, I don't think introducing GTL restrictions is a good thing, especially if you're suggesting it to benefit your own interest. I believe in the free market without any direct developer interventions. Also, you're essentially just talking about 1 single item and you're using it to generalize it's issues and it just doesn't apply to the economy as a whole.

Edited by Dazuzi

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You could just sell stuff for 1 Pokeyen per unit and no one will undercut you.

 

On a more serious note: Sell stuff with a price that no one wants to undercut you if you so desperately need stuff sold. If people aren't buying your stuff for your requested price, maybe your price is higher than the market is willing to pay for it. Even if someone undercuts you by 1 Pokeyen, those items will get sold instantly and your item comes back being the lowest priced item on the market in no time if the price is fair. And sure, I can agree undercutting by 1 yen is kinda scummy as a concept but none of your suggestions are feasible at all.

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I like everstones being cheap. I remember the days they were like 20k or more a piece and now a lot of new players can afford to buy them in bulk which is nice. 

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6 minutes ago, Goku said:

I like everstones being cheap. I remember the days they were like 20k or more a piece and now a lot of new players can afford to buy them in bulk which is nice. 

Double edged sword, with the selling of one everstone you could afford 2 braces or near 2 braces back then. Same with yellow shards.

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1 hour ago, razimove said:

Double edged sword, with the selling of one everstone you could afford 2 braces or near 2 braces back then. Same with yellow shards.

Not really I mean back then there wasn't nearly as much cash flow going around and that was pre-unova so obviously now you got the gym and all the other fun stuff to grind to make up for that. 

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1 hour ago, razimove said:

Double edged sword, with the selling of one everstone you could afford 2 braces or near 2 braces back then. Same with yellow shards.

It's almost like stuff like braces and items from in game vendors should be under constant update of pricing in terms of how much inflation or deflation the economy is going through. Because of the lack of this, it objectively takes more money / time to make a comp.

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7 minutes ago, Goku said:

so obviously now you got the gym and all the other fun stuff to grind to make up for that. 

citation needed

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1 minute ago, Raichu4u said:

It's almost like stuff like braces and items from in game vendors should be under constant update of pricing in terms of how much inflation or deflation the economy is going through. Because of the lack of this, it objectively takes more money / time to make a comp.

The better solution would be to try and fix the inflation/deflation accordingly, as the NPC vendors themselves are supposed to be 'balance point' if you will.

If we're having to adjust them, that means we messed up somewhere down the line.

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17 minutes ago, Goku said:

Not really I mean back then there wasn't nearly as much cash flow going around and that was pre-unova so obviously now you got the gym and all the other fun stuff to grind to make up for that. 

There was, except was more centralized in a small group of people. The gyms gave similiar cash, a tiny bit less, it was adjusted when unova got released.

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5 minutes ago, Darkshade said:

The better solution would be to try and fix the inflation/deflation accordingly, as the NPC vendors themselves are supposed to be 'balance point' if you will.

If we're having to adjust them, that means we messed up somewhere down the line.

They honestly should be balancing around the supply and demand itself. Because there is obviously no form of credit in the game, this economy doesn't have cycles like a real life market would, and is purely influenced by the supply and demand itself. It is a pipe dream for them to think if they could ever "stabilize" it.

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7 minutes ago, razimove said:

There was, except was more centralized in a small group of people. The gyms gave similiar cash, a tiny bit less, it was adjusted when unova got released.

There wasn't thousands of chinese doing berry farming so I highly doubt it. I do agree most of the wealth back then was between a small elite group but right now every other random player got a heavy amount of yen. 

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7 minutes ago, Raichu4u said:

They honestly should be balancing around the supply and demand itself. 

That's the idea, but we're responsible for both the supply and (on some level, in terms of utility) the demand.

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Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, Darkshade said:

That's the idea, but we're responsible for both the supply and (on some level, in terms of utility) the demand.

Then I will say this then: Do you guys realize that after the various price reductions to bands, yen was nerfed from Gym Leader rematches and NPC rematches, making it to where you get less bands for your time? I understand why the yen nerf happened due to an entire region being added, but it pretty much effectively nerfed players who would only casually put in 1-2 hours a day. I worry that this rate of how long it takes to get bands will get worse with Sinnoh's introduction.

Edited by Raichu4u

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Raichu4u said:

Then I will say this then: Do you guys realize that after the various price reductions to bands, yen was nerfed from Gym Leader rematches and NPC rematches, making it to where you get less bands for your time? I understand why the yen nerf happened due to an entire region being added, but it pretty much effectively nerfed players who would only casually put in 1-2 hours a day. I worry that this rate of how long it takes to get bands will get worse with Sinnoh's introduction.

Rn there is too much yen in the game, so they should actually either find another passive way to burn cash, or increase the price of npc items for yen, or remove the berry selling problem, but rn its like trying to fix a glass with duct tape, since the problem is in such a big scale.

Edited by razimove

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2 minutes ago, razimove said:

Rn there is too much yen in the game, so they should actually either find another passive way to burn cash, or increase the price of npc items for yen, or remove the berry selling problem, but rn its like trying to fix a glass with duct tape, since the problem is in such a big scale.

This just makes the game harder for newbies or those with little yen.

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2 minutes ago, Raichu4u said:

This just makes the game harder for newbies or those with little yen.

Its your fault that you have a low amount, and newbies dont really matter in a game that is so time consuming, abuse the method like everyone else, if you cant beat them, join them.

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4 minutes ago, razimove said:

Its your fault that you have a low amount, and newbies dont really matter in a game that is so time consuming, abuse the method like everyone else, if you cant beat them, join them.

No offense, but this is what we call regressive economic policy in the real world, to where it harms those more at the bottom than it does to try and be corrective to those who have all the wealth at the top. 

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4 minutes ago, Raichu4u said:

No offense, but this is what we call regressive economic policy in the real world, to where it harms those more at the bottom than it does to try and be corrective to those who have all the wealth at the top. 

It will always be like this sadly, there is no fair concept, someone will come out on top always. And in this case the problem affects the whole community, not the 10% that started yesterday only. So think about the community as a whole, not as separated by noobs, veterans etc.

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I am not talking just about Everstones. I am talking about all items that don't be sold really fast, for example: Leppa Berry is a really fast sell item, because it is used to farm other items or catch shinys, so you need big amount of it.In another case, Max. PP isn't a fast sell item, maybe if you offer 5 in GTL you will sell it at 1 hour. Now, supose that i am selling 99 Max. PP at 30k. Okay, I have stucked it's price. So another one, will put 99 Max.PP at a lower price, and it will be more stucked. Why did he do this? Because he want to earn money fast, and that is something natural.

 

I mean that the problem it's psychologically, because if someone sees prices from 8k to 7k with variations of 100 pokeyen, but the quantity of that item is low, he won't see the price stuck, because that items will be sold and the stagnation will dissapear.

Unlike if he sees prices from 8k to 7k with variations of 100 pokeyen, and 99 items per sale, he will see that the price is stuck, and as I said previously, he will offer his item at a lower price because he want to earn money fast, and the money will be more stuck.

 

If someone llower prices of an item with a low amount of him, that item's price will be low for one day or some hours.But if he lower that item's price with 99 units of him, it's price will be low for days or weeks.

 

Don't live in a fantasy world, maybe your solution is that persons don't lower prices, but that is impossible. You can't control all world's desicion. If someone wants to lower the price, he will do, you can't stop this.

 

Because of this, I said maybe a time or quantity restriction could help. 

 

The theory of supply and demand could help, but try to think solutions. It doesn't work if you make an explanation of all you have learned in school or university, use that to think a solution for this. If you don't like my solution, try to offer a better one, you are welcome.

 

See ya.

Kmikzee

 

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20 minutes ago, KmiKzee said:

I am not talking just about Everstones. I am talking about all items that don't be sold really fast, for example: Leppa Berry is a really fast sell item, because it is used to farm other items or catch shinys, so you need big amount of it.In another case, Max. PP isn't a fast sell item, maybe if you offer 5 in GTL you will sell it at 1 hour. Now, supose that i am selling 99 Max. PP at 30k. Okay, I have stucked it's price. So another one, will put 99 Max.PP at a lower price, and it will be more stucked. Why did he do this? Because he want to earn money fast, and that is something natural.

 

I mean that the problem it's psychologically, because if someone sees prices from 8k to 7k with variations of 100 pokeyen, but the quantity of that item is low, he won't see the price stuck, because that items will be sold and the stagnation will dissapear.

Unlike if he sees prices from 8k to 7k with variations of 100 pokeyen, and 99 items per sale, he will see that the price is stuck, and as I said previously, he will offer his item at a lower price because he want to earn money fast, and the money will be more stuck.

 

If someone llower prices of an item with a low amount of him, that item's price will be low for one day or some hours.But if he lower that item's price with 99 units of him, it's price will be low for days or weeks.

 

Don't live in a fantasy world, maybe your solution is that persons don't lower prices, but that is impossible. You can't control all world's desicion. If someone wants to lower the price, he will do, you can't stop this.

 

Because of this, I said maybe a time or quantity restriction could help. 

 

The theory of supply and demand could help, but try to think solutions. It doesn't work if you make an explanation of all you have learned in school or university, use that to think a solution for this. If you don't like my solution, try to offer a better one, you are welcome.

 

See ya.

Kmikzee

 

Didnt read all, as Im working, judt read the last part, doesnt matter if we like it or not, it most likely wont happen, its on squirtle hands if he wants to change something or not.

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7 minutes ago, TheBlueExorcist said:

The problem are the chineses :c they created their Own economy and now everybody here are entering to that

Do you mind explaining this a little further, as if why exactly you think that they are the sole problem?

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