Steelix vs. Ferrothorn ?

[TheBacon2UrSoap]

Between the two, which do you think is better and why?

[suigin]

Ferrothorn.

Better typing, stats, movepool, support options, etc.

[OrangeManiac]

The only thing Steelix has going for it is that its defense is absolutely god-like. However, there are very limited amount of Pokemon in the OU and UU tier that would get completely walled by Steelix' defensive typing because every physical attacker uses Earthquake or Superpower and no special attackers ever struggles with Steelix at all and that's Steelix' main drawback as a reliable defensive tank. That, and lack of any kind of recovery whatsoever besides Rest, which most of the time is an awful move.

 

The advantages for Ferrothorn, however:

 

1. Iron Barbs. This is such a wonderful ability I can't praise it enough. That 12,5 % damage from a contact move is absolutely nuts.

2. Leech Seed. Extremely helpful reliable recovery move.

3. Dual entry hazards. Where as Steelix is only limited to Stealth Rocks, Ferrothorn can throw in Spikes too. And not always you even should opt to use this move but keeping opponent on their toes by constantly being afraid of further hazards is great.

4. Offensive coverage. Steel + Ground offensive coverage is kinda bad. Steel brings basically nothing to Ground offensively, besides the ability to hit Flying-types neutrally. And even considering that, so many Flying-types are Water-Flying (Mantine, Gyarados, Pelipper). Meanwhile Ferrothorn's offensive coverage is actually great. The main thing walling Gyro Ball is Water-types and Power Whip is there to pick them off.

[TheBacon2UrSoap]

On 4/15/2018 at 2:48 AM, OrangeManiac said:

The only thing Steelix has going for it is that its defense is absolutely god-like. However, there are very limited amount of Pokemon in the OU and UU tier that would get completely walled by Steelix' defensive typing because every physical attacker uses Earthquake or Superpower and no special attackers ever struggles with Steelix at all and that's Steelix' main drawback as a reliable defensive tank. That, and lack of any kind of recovery whatsoever besides Rest, which most of the time is an awful move.

 

The advantages for Ferrothorn, however:

 

1. Iron Barbs. This is such a wonderful ability I can't praise it enough. That 12,5 % damage from a contact move is absolutely nuts.

2. Leech Seed. Extremely helpful reliable recovery move.

3. Dual entry hazards. Where as Steelix is only limited to Stealth Rocks, Ferrothorn can throw in Spikes too. And not always you even should opt to use this move but keeping opponent on their toes by constantly being afraid of further hazards is great.

4. Offensive coverage. Steel + Ground offensive coverage is kinda bad. Steel brings basically nothing to Ground offensively, besides the ability to hit Flying-types neutrally. And even considering that, so many Flying-types are Water-Flying (Mantine, Gyarados, Pelipper). Meanwhile Ferrothorn's offensive coverage is actually great. The main thing walling Gyro Ball is Water-types and Power Whip is there to pick them off.

Very comprehensive opinion--thank you for your input.

Do you use Gyro Ball on Ferrothorn? I've used it on Steelix before, but it always seemed to do next to nothing for damage, even with a nature that reduces speed and 3 uses of Curse in-battle, it just hasn't seemed to do much of anything.

[razimove]

2 hours ago, TheBacon2UrSoap said:

Do you use Gyro Ball on Ferrothorn?

Yes, it's a really strong stab and your bread and butter vs a nice portion of the offensive pokemons. 

You want relaxed, 0 speed IV, 0 speed EV. This will maximize your damage. 

[OrangeManiac]

5 hours ago, TheBacon2UrSoap said:

Very comprehensive opinion--thank you for your input.

Do you use Gyro Ball on Ferrothorn? I've used it on Steelix before, but it always seemed to do next to nothing for damage, even with a nature that reduces speed and 3 uses of Curse in-battle, it just hasn't seemed to do much of anything.

Steelix should use Heavy Slam instead of Gyro Ball. Steelix gets max damage from Heavy Slam very often whereas it gets max damage Gyro Ball pretty much never. Luckily Ferrothorn is 10 base speed slower than Steelix is so Ferrothorn does much bigger damage with Gyro Ball than Steelix does.