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RNG-less battle mode


Roundabout

Question

Make an alternative battle mode that disables critical hits, random burns/freezes, effect spore, and such effects. I know that RNG keeps the game interesting, but it can also be really frustrating at times. The only form of RNG that could maybe be kept in such a game mode is the move accuraccy, because you usually are trading accuracy for power, at your own risk.

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4 hours ago, notmudkip0 said:

Everything should have flat 100 base stats too, and every move should have 60 power with no added effects.

Thats not even a good comparison dude, you CAN control/predict what pokemons your opponent is using and moves they should use, but there's no way to control bad RNG, it can often steal wins for the worse player, which isn't good for competitive environment. Ofc I'm not saying these should be removed entirely from the game, but removing RNG would be a good way to make an alternative, more competitive, battle mode that relies more on skill and less on random crap

 

3 hours ago, KakuRoku said:

No. That sounds boring.

Care to elaborate why?

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Summary of the Video:
Change the tournament structure to remove 'single elimination' from OFFICIAL PokeMMO Tournaments and instead consider setting up 'Leagues' where the effects of RNG are greatly diminished.  The problem most game devs have is that they only look at the 'macro' (big) picture instead of the 'micro' (individual) match picture.
If we want to do single-elimination then I agree with those who want a mode based far less on RNG.  Maybe no critical hits allowed.  Maybe change a lot of variables to fixed values in some way.  But I feel it would be far easier and far less hassle for devs and players to just alter the tournament structure of PokeMMO tournaments so they aren't the typical 'single elimination' style.  Have them be more 'round robin' style perhaps.


These videos sum it up nicely, @Roundabout:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9ZI9kMsvRQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRHdIScOMWQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0V5eq4IQ6Go

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiOA_CS25Kw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e31OSVZF77w

Edited by Daedalus007
changed to links because walls of video aren't mobile-friendly
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On 27/02/2018 at 6:12 PM, Kite said:

How about no. Also there is no RNG, just a certain % chance of something happening. 

Thats what we know as RNG

 

On 27/02/2018 at 6:12 PM, Kite said:

The status effects are part of the game, just have to deal with it.

Yes they are, and thats why I'm suggesting a new mode without them, I never said I want them to be removed permanently from the game

 

 

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Just now, Roundabout said:

Thats what we know as RNG

 

Yes they are, and thats why I'm suggesting a new mode without them, I never said I want them to be removed permanently from the game

 

 

RNG isn't a percent chance however. To remove them for a special gamemode would be extremely unbalanced. Sometimes you do need that crit to break a set up mon that has been set up completely and is going to sweep your team. Even just hindering it with secondary effects is useful. Having a game mode like what you want. Is over all, really bad. 

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Just now, Kite said:

RNG isn't a percent chance however. To remove them for a special gamemode would be extremely unbalanced. Sometimes you do need that crit to break a set up mon that has been set up completely and is going to sweep your team. Even just hindering it with secondary effects is useful. Having a game mode like what you want. Is over all, really bad. 

if you let that set up mon set up on you at first place is because you're bad, or because that mon is unbalanced (in which case it should be banned or nerfed), secondary effects like burn, sleep and poison should still exist, but just not through random crap.

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13 minutes ago, Roundabout said:

if you let that set up mon set up on you at first place is because you're bad, or because that mon is unbalanced (in which case it should be banned or nerfed), secondary effects like burn, sleep and poison should still exist, but just not through random crap.

Not completely. For example say I have a Lickilicky that is physically defensive. Its ability is Oblivious and ignores things like Taunt. So I say use Curse. My defense rises, attack rises, but my speed lowers. What are you going to do? Put it to sleep just so I can use sleep talk and continue to boost? Use Toxic on it? Sorry not an answer because I have Rest. Also keep in mind, Lickilicky is specially bulky naturally. The moment I set up cause you can't take it down before it set up completely to +6 attack +6 defense. Your only option is the crit to ignore the defense boost pray to god that you'll be able to OHKO it. 

Just to give you an idea check out this 1 battle. My opponent wasn't bad at all. He just couldn't deal with it. That is what you're suggestion is probably going to promote. Hell a pokemon doesn't need to be set up to +6 to be able to sweep. I had a Hawlucha that held Electric Seed had Acrobatics, Swords Dance, Poison Jab, and High Jump Kick and I 6-0 a person after I used 1 Swords Dance.  So being "bad" has nothing to do with it. You get put into unfavorable situations cause you happened to not have an answer. And you can't have an answer for everything. Granted our Meta is very different from Pokemon Showdown but the situations do happen and happen often enough.

 

Edited by Kite
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15 minutes ago, Kite said:

Not completely. For example say I have a Lickilicky that is physically defensive. Its ability is Oblivious and ignores things like Taunt. So I say use Curse. My defense rises, attack rises, but my speed lowers. What are you going to do? Put it to sleep just so I can use sleep talk and continue to boost? Use Toxic on it? Sorry not an answer because I have Rest. Also keep in mind, Lickilicky is specially bulky naturally. The moment I set up cause you can't take it down before it set up completely to +6 attack +6 defense. Your only option is the crit to ignore the defense boost pray to god that you'll be able to OHKO it. 

Just to give you an idea check out this 1 battle. My opponent wasn't bad at all. He just couldn't deal with it. That is what you're suggestion is probably going to promote. Hell a pokemon doesn't need to be set up to +6 to be able to sweep. I had a Hawlucha that held Electric Seed had Acrobatics, Swords Dance, Poison Jab, and High Jump Kick and I 6-0 a person after I used 1 Swords Dance.  So being "bad" has nothing to do with it. You get put into unfavorable situations cause you happened to not have an answer. And you can't have an answer for everything. 

 

Yeah, and thats exactly where skill would matter, by forcing players to build a team that can actually deal with most potential threats?

 

On 27/02/2018 at 5:46 PM, Daedalus007 said:

Summary of the Video:
Change the tournament structure to remove 'single elimination' from OFFICIAL PokeMMO Tournaments and instead consider setting up 'Leagues' where the effects of RNG are greatly diminished.  The problem most game devs have is that they only look at the 'macro' (big) picture instead of the 'micro' (individual) match picture.
If we want to do single-elimination then I agree with those who want a mode based far less on RNG.  Maybe no critical hits allowed.  Maybe change a lot of variables to fixed values in some way.  But I feel it would be far easier and far less hassle for devs and players to just alter the tournament structure of PokeMMO tournaments so they aren't the typical 'single elimination' style.  Have them be more 'round robin' style perhaps.


These videos sum it up nicely, @Roundabout:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9ZI9kMsvRQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRHdIScOMWQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0V5eq4IQ6Go

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiOA_CS25Kw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e31OSVZF77w

Thanks for the videos, and yeah that would work, but the problem is that if you truly wanted to balance out the odds then it'd take a lot of games, and it would make tournaments significantly longer, and couldn't be played on a single day as it's done today, and could even make the game boring

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9 minutes ago, Roundabout said:

Yeah, and thats exactly where skill would matter, by forcing players to build a team that can actually deal with most potential threats?

Yes skill will matter. but again your team can't have everything since you're still limited in the amount of pokemon that you can use. And what if the opponent kept back one of their set up mons and forced you to bring out your answer early? Shit happens is all I'm saying. 

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6 minutes ago, Kite said:

Yes skill will matter. but again your team can't have everything since you're still limited in the amount of pokemon that you can use. And what if the opponent kept back one of their set up mons and forced you to bring out your answer early? Shit happens is all I'm saying. 

yeah, but it won't happen simply (most of the time) due to bad luck

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7 hours ago, Kite said:

Can't be assumed to be a casual when you don't know my in-game name. But you know nice attempt there. 

If you don't reveal your IGN, then we're gonna assume you're casual and you can't back up your argument. Nice try tho. ;)

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12 minutes ago, Suneet said:

If you don't reveal your IGN, then we're gonna assume you're casual and you can't back up your argument. Nice try tho. ;)

That is implying either is remotely relevant to the thread which isn't. Almost buddy, try again. 

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