Senile Posted October 27, 2017 Author Share Posted October 27, 2017 6 minutes ago, redspawn said: ''fairly hard consumable'', is there anything money can't buy? with a economy as broken as we currently have, anyone I find, I expect them to have 20m+ without breaking a sweat. Harvesting is way to profitable, alt run aswell, so don't think that's the right approach to the subject, as long as there is someone selling, someone will buy. I agree that he can't really do much to skarmory, and that he's somewhat vulnerable to many threats. Do you believe although, that people won't lead Wall Ttar or even hyper offensive? I believe there'll be a lot of ttar leads tbh. Yeah I guess, you could say the same to ttar, lots of focus blast users in OU, I seriously think you guys are underestimating him(p2). Ofc he doens't survive fighting, but nor does milotic hold a jolteon specs well. Excadrill although, can be a threat on mold breaker aswell, a really strong one, I'd probably say one of the strongest wall breakers we might get in the OU tier if he doens't get banned. Okay, I don't get it. How is Mold Breaker Excadrill any better at wallbreaking than Sand Rush? The only OU pokemon affected by Mold Breaker are Gengar, Forretress, and Skarmory. Gengar is demolished by Iron Head anyway, and outsped by Exca in sandstorm w/ Rush anyway. Forretress and Skarmory only matter if they're at full HP with Sturdy, which might not even happen, because of SR. Even then, Forretress is a terrible Excadrill answer, and if your Skarmory is getting 100-0'd by Excadrill, you have bigger problems than Mold Breaker on your hands m8. Link to comment
razimove Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Senile said: Okay, I don't get it. How is Mold Breaker Excadrill any better at wallbreaking than Sand Rush? The only OU pokemon affected by Mold Breaker are Gengar, Forretress, and Skarmory. Gengar is demolished by Iron Head anyway, and outsped by Exca in sandstorm w/ Rush anyway. Forretress and Skarmory only matter if they're at full HP with Sturdy, which might not even happen, because of SR. Even then, Forretress is a terrible Excadrill answer, and if your Skarmory is getting 100-0'd by Excadrill, you have bigger problems than Mold Breaker on your hands m8. wait what where did I say he was better, never said it ahah, just said he's a really strong one even with mold breaker. And yes, for sure Forretress isn't a good answer, I also see that. Overall I agree with what you said. I just can see some things being ridiculous in OU due to how strong they are, hydreigon being the one that I saw first in the list, and some not being there, when they are either a really good BL candidate or maybe harmful for the other tier. Edited October 27, 2017 by redspawn Link to comment
Senile Posted October 27, 2017 Author Share Posted October 27, 2017 1 minute ago, redspawn said: wait what where did I say he was better, never said it ahah, just said he's a really strong one even with mold breaker. And yes, for sure Forretress isn't a good answer, I also see that. Overall I agree with what you said. I just can see some things being ridiculous in OU due to how strong they are, hydreigon being the one that I saw first in the list, and some not being there, when they are either a really good BL candidate or maybe harmful for the other tier. Here you go: 43 minutes ago, redspawn said: Well, soon you'll find out I guess about Donphan, give time to time. Plus I can only see excadill going uber as soon as HA hit and he climbs up. Not saying he's a must have pick, but you can't compare him to exca. Especially consider how much focus blast users, hp fires etc, there'll be, but then again only time can tell on that one, still can't see why compare both other than the fact they share equal typing and both work well as spinners. Good bulk, ice move with priority, overall awesome atk stat, and good typing non the less, plus sturdy. Mold Breaker is his hidden ability. razimove 1 Link to comment
razimove Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Just now, Senile said: Here you go: Mold Breaker is his hidden ability. lmao fuck my bad, I was under the impression was the opposite. Link to comment
pachima Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Senile said: Okay, I don't get it. How is Mold Breaker Excadrill any better at wallbreaking than Sand Rush? The only OU pokemon affected by Mold Breaker are Gengar, Forretress, and Skarmory. 2 ???? Edit: Nvm, I got it, but too much of a rarity. Edited October 27, 2017 by pachima Link to comment
suigin Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 2 minutes ago, pachima said: ???? +6 252+ Atk Choice Band Mold Breaker Excadrill Rock Slide vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 314-370 (94.2 - 111.1%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO ez Link to comment
pachima Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 1 minute ago, suigin said: +6 252+ Atk Choice Band Mold Breaker Excadrill Rock Slide vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 314-370 (94.2 - 111.1%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO ez + 6 choice band kek. GBush and DrButler 2 Link to comment
Munya Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Just now, pachima said: + 6 choice band kek. Just have to get swaggered 3 times Kizhaz 1 Link to comment
Toast Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 1 hour ago, pachima said: + 6 choice band kek. baton pass ez Link to comment
TiToooo Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 chansey uber pls with eviolite is so op Link to comment
notmudkip0 Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 1 hour ago, TiToooo said: chansey uber pls with eviolite is so op Not likely with all the fighting types, psyshock and dugtrio. Link to comment
DoubleJ Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Wait, are we getting the Air Balloon? Any confirmations? Link to comment
dandif Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 I did not see bullet punch and aqua jet on the pts information, will be they included? that atack is really important for scizor Link to comment
Senile Posted October 27, 2017 Author Share Posted October 27, 2017 Just now, DoubleJ said: Wait, are we getting the Air Balloon? Any confirmations? It's in Gen 5, don't see any reason why we wouldn't. AFAIK we're getting most (if not all?) future gen hold items, such as the gems, sash, rocky helmet, eviolite, etc.; I don't really have any specific confirmation on all of them, but I haven't been led to believe any are being excluded. 2 minutes ago, dandif said: I did not see bullet punch and aqua jet on the pts information, will be they included? that atack is really important for scizor They should be, and the list was made with that assumption in mind. DoubleJ 1 Link to comment
DoubleJ Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Just now, Senile said: It's in Gen 5, don't see any reason why we wouldn't. AFAIK we're getting most (if not all?) future gen hold items, such as the gems, sash, rocky helmet, eviolite, etc.; I don't really have any specific confirmation on all of them, but I haven't been led to believe any are being excluded. I always tend to worry about items when it comes to the development team. It would be nice if players in game could "unearth" the locations on these items from the test server. Link to comment
Munya Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Just now, DoubleJ said: I always tend to worry about items when it comes to the development team. It would be nice if players in game could "unearth" the locations on these items from the test server. Pretty sure most items will be available in some way, I wouldn't necessarily use the test server as a guaranteed spot for those items yet idk how much work has been done on their placements. The only thing that I -think- will not be added are the plates because we already have type boosting items that accomplish the same thing. DoubleJ 1 Link to comment
Senile Posted October 28, 2017 Author Share Posted October 28, 2017 The initial Little Cup Banlist has been added to the OP of the thread. Munya 1 Link to comment
OrangeManiac Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 (edited) I think Misdreavus is definitely too strong to LC as well. Murkrow also seems kinda too good of a sweeper but not as sure about this one. (Edit: Oh, Murkrow is banned in gen5 but MisD isn't, interesting) Also, is Baton Pass finally gonna be revisited when Unova comes out? I know it's uncompetitive move by nature but let's be honest, Baton Pass got banned ages ago and that was because of its current metagame so the least we could do it at least try to bring it back or to discuss 1 BP / team clause and if they aren't enough then I guess flat ban it. But I don't think it should just forever remain banned without even being revisited once. I made the assumption you were gonna keep it banned because it was specified that in LC Baton Pass is allowed. Edited October 28, 2017 by OrangeManiac DoubleJ and aftershocker 2 Link to comment
Senile Posted October 28, 2017 Author Share Posted October 28, 2017 Just now, OrangeManiac said: I think Misdreavus is definitely too strong to LC as well. Murkrow also seems kinda too good of a sweeper but not as sure about this one as MisD. Also, is Baton Pass finally be revisited when Unova comes out? I know it's uncompetitive move by nature but let's be honest, Baton Pass got banned ages ago and that was because of it's current metagame so the least we could do it at least try to bring it back or to discuss 1 BP / team clause and if they aren't enough then I guess flat ban it. But I don't think it should just forever remain banned without even being revisited once. Don't really agree on Misdreavus. It's definitely a top tier, S-rank threat in LC, but without Dazzling Gleam and the Steel nerfs, it's nowhere near as overwhelming as it was in Gen 6. There's a good reason it got banned in Gen 6+, but not Gen 5. It's definitely one of those pokemon on the borderline, and probably going to be the first pokemon looked at, but IMO it's not on the level of the other banned pokemon, where it deserves to be autobanned. I'd agree with Murkrow if it had Prankster, since that pushes it way over the top for me. But without it, I definitely think it's worth testing, and don't expect it to be too bad. Nope, not at all. Baton Pass got unbanned in LC because, quite frankly, there's much less room to exploit in LC, so we thought it was worth giving a shot. With that being said, don't get your hopes up about BP. Honestly, I wouldn't expect it to ever be allowed in the standard tiers again in any capacity. Baton Pass is just a consistently, terribly obnoxious threat all around. If anything, I think it'll become significantly more unmanageable now than it was when it got permabanned, since there are significantly more options (and better options) for solo-passers in the new metagame. Naturally, I don't speak for the whole TC. With that being said, after the total clown fiesta that was the Gen 6/7 BP Clauses, I'm pretty heavily opposed to clausing BP at all; It's better off just staying flat banned. DoubleJ 1 Link to comment
Gunthug Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 Yeah there's no need to test BP lol there is no meta even conceivable where it is competitive DoubleJ 1 Link to comment
DoubleJ Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 Keep BP banned pls. Ty. Link to comment
OrangeManiac Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 20 minutes ago, Senile said: With that being said, don't get your hopes up about BP. Honestly, I wouldn't expect it to ever be allowed in the standard tiers again in any capacity. Baton Pass is just a consistently, terribly obnoxious threat all around. If anything, I think it'll become significantly more unmanageable now than it was when it got permabanned, since there are significantly more options (and better options) for solo-passers in the new metagame. Naturally, I don't speak for the whole TC. With that being said, after the total clown fiesta that was the Gen 6/7 BP Clauses, I'm pretty heavily opposed to clausing BP at all; It's better off just staying flat banned. I don't think we can make the assumption it's more unmanageable. Even though there would be more and better options as Baton Passers but at the same time increased firepower and team preview prevents setting up (and Baton Passing) being that easy. We don't know. Don't take it as I exactly even want BP to come back. It's a move that can potentially limit the significance of skillful play so all fine by me if it stays banned forever. But then again, it's an archetype of its own - a part of not just a specific metagame but Pokemon metagame. I don't think a whole archetype can be scratched off the face of the Earth (or this game) because 9 or so people find it unfair, especially without a proper community discussion backed by actual empirical evidence and not just theorymon. That's just me, I don't know. But if you already have decided under any circumstances it's banworthy and you won't be convinced otherwise then I guess it makes sense to just start having it flat banned to prevent any unnecessary shakes in tierlists. KOHHuiXIN 1 Link to comment
Zymogen Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 (edited) Ew Dugtrio OU? Someone tell me why this is even being considered? Especially with the addition of focus sash??? Edited October 28, 2017 by Zymogen Osuki and gbwead 2 Link to comment
Evlgoon Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 bronzong will probably be ou, with wish support from chansey/blissey its a really good check to a lot of things. Slowbro and tangrowth will most likely be ou even without regenerator just by necessity, right now you have only 7 pokemon that can be dedicated walls and they overlap with 2 of them being chansey/blissey and then 3 of them being steel hazard setters. obviously some of the pokemon you listed can use more defensive sets like gyarados but without the power creep from all of the legends i think a lot of the stuff that would normally be uu will be ou in our meta.Other walls that will probably see high usage in ou are alomomola, amoonguss, and mandibuzz, obviously hidden abilities would make some of these better but even without them they will probably be good enough for the tier. I also haven't seen anyone mention mienshao who will probably be one of our better scarf users. DoubleJ 1 Link to comment
notmudkip0 Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 5 minutes ago, Evlgoon said: Slowbro and tangrowth will most likely be ou even without regenerator just by necessity I can only see Slowbro being OU early because most players will be more familiar with using it, and also because they have easier access to it. Even with Regenerator it would be kinda niche in OU. I don't expect anything with Regenerator as HA to be OU until release, and even then it's iffy. 44 minutes ago, Evlgoon said: I also haven't seen anyone mention mienshao who will probably be one of our better scarf users. I guess its usage in OU really depends on how popular Jellicent, and maybe Starmie and Gengar. Gliscor won't be a common sight at the very least. Link to comment
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