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      Rules for Ingame | Forums | IRC   04/29/2016

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suigin

New Gen introductory guide

36 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

I've seen a lot of people be intimidated by the new gen, some of them even saying they'd leave since there would be a ton of additional grind either due to their comps becoming useless or because of new comps creeping up the place. However in a lot of cases some older comps will still be pretty viable in their tiers and some might only need a minor change to remain viable. Others however will need re-eving or even re-breeding. With this guide I plan to list all the changes the new gen will bring to most Pokemon. Keep in mind Hidden Abilities might not be added on the same patch as gen5 so don't invest on breeders for something that relies on its hidden ability yet.

 

Bolded and underlined will be content I'm not 100% sure will be released in patch 1, due to certain moves being BW2 tutors, keep in mind the devs may work around this issue.


142.gif-Aerodactyl-
Most Aerodactyls are Jolly max speed and use Choice Band, nothing really changes here, this set is still viable however now it gains the ability to be the fastest Stealth Rock (Entry Hazard like Spikes, but only needs to be set up once and hurts flying types too) setter in the tier and one of the fastest Taunters so it does great as a lead with focus sash.

It also gains access to Roost to recover health, Stone Edge a more powerful rock type move, Fire Fang, Ice Fang, Thunder Fang and Aqua Tail for coverage and Hone claws to boost its attack and accuracy.
You don't really need to change anything here except for maybe a few moves if you want to.

 

065.gif-Alakazam-
Now has actual Fighting type coverage with Focus Blast, a 120BP attack with a high chance to miss and a 10% chance to lower opposing SpDef. It also gains Energy Ball, a grass type move with 80 BP, it's pretty neat coverage if you need it.

 

059.gif-Arcanine-
Arcanine retains its role as an effective defensive pivot here and gains a new tool this time around to force physical attackers out for sure, Will-o-Wisp. However if you wanted to make a more offensive oriented Arcanine now you have access to Flare Blitz(Fire type Double Edge) Wild Charge (Physical electric move with recoil) and Close Combat (120 BP Fighting type move that lowers your defenses), this last one however is an egg move. These offensive sets aren't particularly strong but they can catch some Pokemon off guard and work as lures.

 

184.gif-Azumarill-
Due to how MMO's egg move breeding works Azumarill will now have access to both Belly Drum and Aqua Jet(Water type Quick Attack), you'll have to re-breed your Azu but this means after one Belly Drum, Azumarill can nail everything in its path unless it's non weakened grass type that can out speed it. Think of it as Linoone but with 150 Base attack and more sets instead of just Belly Drum. Definitely a big OU threat.

 

257.gif-Blaziken-    
Gets pretty much outclassed by Infernape in everything it does. Technically Blaziken deals more damage but the versatility and utility Infernape provides is just way too much to compare.

However Infernape may not be released yet so don't trash your blazes.

 

286.gif-Breloom-
Remember how obnoxious this guy was during the Snorlax meta? Well now with access to Poison Heal (Just ability capsule it) he gains an actual ability that allows him to become immune to status effects and heal a ridiculous amount of hp just by holding a Toxic Orb. Sub Punch is probably still its strongest set but a bulkier Sub-Seed set is also pretty annoying and forces a lot of switches.

 

113.gif-Chansey-
Gets Stealth Rock, meaning on the free switch you get from switching into a special attacker now you can set them up easily. It also gets to use Eviolite, an item that boosts its defenses by 1.5, meaning it becomes almost as physically bulky as Swampert and has unrivaled Special Bulk.

 

006.gif-Charizard-
Now gets mauled alive by Stealth Rock, which means Belly Drum sets are really hard to pull off. if you use this guy then make sure you have a Rapid Spinner, besides that Dragon Dance sets now can use Flare Blitz and now it gains access to Roost(Flying Type recovery move that removes the Flying type the turn it's used).

 

036.gif-Clefable-

Gains Stealth Rock, Magic Guard as an ability makes it immune to all non direct damage (Sandstorm, hail, poison, burn, spikes, Stealth Rock, etc), definitely neat to have around.

 

091.gif-Cloyster-
Becomes less effective as a physical wall due to a number of reasons (Namely a weakness to stealth rock and some common new implemented moves) but now has access to Toxic Spikes (Either poison or badly poison the opponent on the switch depending on how many layers you have, it's removed by Poison types on the switch though). Gains Skill Link as an ability, allowing it to hit multi-hit moves 5 times no matter what and Ice Shard an Ice type Quick attack. On top of that it gets a boosting move named Shell Smash which sharply raises its attack, special attack and speed in exchange for lowering his defenses.

You may want to breed one that has Rock Blast and make it either Jolly or Adamant but other than that your old bulky Cloysters will likely still be useful.

 

169.gif-Crobat-
Gets Brave Bird (Flying type Double Edge) and Nasty Plot (Special Attack version of Swords Dance) meaning it becomes more effective as a special and physical attacker and it also gets Roost and U-Turn (A move that hits the opponent and then switches out, useful to hit whatever the opponent switches into and still have the matchup advantage).
Brave Bird and Nasty Plot are egg moves so it might require rebreeding

 

085_f.gif-Dodrio-
Now gets Swords Dance, Jump Kick and Brave Bird (Flying type Double Edge), can now use Payback(50BP Dark Type move that deals twice as much damage if the opponent moves first).
Brave Bird is an egg move so it might require rebreeding.

 

232.gif-Donphan-
Gains Ice Shard (Ice type quick attack), Stealth Rock and Stone Edge.
Still does what it always did so no rebreeding needed.

 

149.gif-Dragonite-
Gains Draco Meteor (Dragon Type overheat), Hurricane (110 BP 70% acc special attacking flying type move with a 30% chance to confuse) and Roost as recovery.

 

356.gif-Dusclops-
Gains an evolution and Shadow Sneak (Ghost type Quick Attack) so unless you leveled this to 100 you don't have to rebreed, just evolve it.
Doesn't really need rebreeding, holding an Eviolite will make it way bulkier than its evolution meaning you only miss out on the 100 atk its evolution gains.

 

125.gif-Electabuzz-
Gets an Evolution

 

330.gif-Flygon-
Its Scarf set received a massive buff with access to U-Turn and now gains Dragon Dance making a sub set up set pretty good, gains Roost as well to heal up damage and also gets special STAB moves with Earth Power, Dragon Pulse and Draco Meteor if you wanna lure physical walls.

 

205.gif-Forretress-
Now gains more offensive options with Gyro Ball(Steel Type Attack that does more damage the faster the opponent is compared to you) and Payback. Also can set up Stealth Rock and Toxic Spikes as well as spin. It also gains access to Volt Switch, allowing it to safely pivot into other Pokemon and escape any magnets switching in.

 

282.gif-Gardevoir-
Gains Focus Blast and Energy Ball

 

094.gif-Gengar-
Gains Focus Blast meaning it gets perfect neutral coverage, and Dark Pulse (Dark type 80BP special move) but it's redundant on Gengar.

 

207.gif-Gligar-
Gets an Evolution, Stealth Rocks and Roost, however it can make for a pretty sturdy wall with Eviolite.

 

076.gif-Golem-

Golem gains access to Heavy Slam, Gyro Ball, Hammer Arm, Iron Head, Stone Edge, Stealth Rock,  Sucker Punch, a priority move and Autonomize and Rock Polish which raise its speed by 2

 

130.gif-Gyarados-
Gains Rock Coverage with Stone Edge (100BP 80 ACC Rock move with high crit chance) and ice fang, other than that nothing changes, it's still the same beastly snake.

 

297.gif-Hariyama-
This one goes for all Guts users but now they have access to Toxic and Flame Orbs which activate Guts on them. Besides that this guy gets Bullet Punch (Steel type quick attack) from breeding with Hitmonchan, Stone Edge, Payback and Close Combat, just stronger moves.
If you want bullet punch then you'll have to rebreed with Hitmonchan

 

214.gif-Heracross-
Becomes even stronger with Close Combat (120BP Fighting move that lowers defenses), Night Slash(75 BP Dark type move) and Stone Edge. Works exactly the same as he used to but with stronger moves.

 

229.gif-Houndoom-
Gains Dark Pulse as a Special Dark type STAB and Nasty Plot which lets him set up and deal a lot of damage. Pure special dooms can actually become a thing now but the physical ones won't fade away since pursuit is just that good.

 

135.gifJolteon

Gains Volt Switch which allows it to force many switches while keeping momentum.

 

230.gif-Kingdra-
Now gains Draco Meteor (120 BP Dragon type Overheat) and Sniper, an ability that makes its Crits deal more damage, coupled with Focus Energy and Scope Lens you should reach nearly 100% crit rate and turn into a fearsome wallbreaker.

 

281.gif-Kirlia-
Gets an alternate evolution.

 

272.gif-Ludicolo-
Gains Energy Ball, Seed Bomb and Zen Headbutt, just a bit more coverage. Nothing really changes with this guy. If Hidden Abilities get released it will make a nice pair with Politoed though.

 

068.gif-Machamp-
Now this guy gets No Guard, an ability that makes it so moves never miss meaning you can fire 100% accurate DynamicPunches with 100% accurate confusion chance, also gets 100% accurate Stone Edges, a powerful Dark type move to punish Psychic or Ghost switch ins with Payback and on top of that he gets priority with bullet punch.
Bullet Punch however is obtained as an egg move from Hitmonchan so if you want it then you'll have to rebreed.


082.gif-Magneton-
Gains an evolution. No need to rebreed unless you got it to level 100 and really want Magnezone, they are more or less the same pokemon though.

 

226.gif-Mantine-
Mantine was originally conceived as the specially defensive equivalent of Skarmory. However for long it suffered due to its lack of recovery, lack of utility and the fact that it was overshadowed by Chan/Blissey as a special wall. Gen7 gave it Roost and as such it became a great special wall.  
The only new egg move it can get is Tailwind which doubles the speed of your team for 2 turns so if you wanna get that then go ahead and rebreed but if you don't feel like you need it then you're good to go with a bulky nature.

 

105.gif-Marowak-
Doesn't really get any new tools to utilize itself but with the implementation of Trick Room incredibly slow hard hitters like this guy can become fearsome sweepers for a few turns.

 

308.gif-Medicham-
Gets Zen headbutt as a secondary STAB as well as priority with Bullet Punch
Bullet Punch is an egg move from Hitmonchan so if you want that then you gotta rebreed.

 

376.gif-Metagross-
Now has access to Bullet Punch, Stealth Rock, Grass Knot (Not really that viable but if you wanna lure Swamperts to their deaths this move will do it for you) and a secondary physical STAB in Zen Headbutt (90 BP 90 ACC Physical Psychic move that can cause Flinching) so Weezing should watch out now.
No rebreeding needed, maybe in some cases some re-eving but only if you absolutely need it.

 

198.gif-Murkrow-
Gets an Evolution Will likely require rebreeding with a nature that lowers its defense and raises its attack.

 

279.gif-Pelipper-

Good old water Golbat here gets Drizzle, Kyogre's signature ability, as an ability in gen 7 however apparently the devs added it here as well, with the addition of Hurricane a 110 BP special flying type move that never misses in the rain, U-Turn, Roost and Scald, Pelipper becomes the best rain setter in the game. However I have not personally confirmed that it gets Drizzle so don't get too excited.

 

221.gif-Piloswine-
Gets an evolution if you have a Jolly or Adamant one you're fine, just spec more in speed evs instead of bulk.

 

233.gif-Porygon2-
Gets an evolution that plays completely different from it. Your Porygon2 will remain viable as a bulky wall however you have a more offensive speedy variant of it then you can evolve it into Porygon Z. Besides that it gets Dark Pulse and is a good Trick Room setter and access to Eviolite making the already bulky duck even bulkier.

 

112.gif-Rhydon-
Gets an evolution.

 

315.gif-Roselia-
Gets an evolution.

 

373.gif-Salamence-
Gets Roost and Draco Meteor Slightly better hybrid options.

 

254.gif-Sceptile-
Gets Energy Ball, Focus Blast and Leaf Storm (Grass type Overheat with 140 BP). Just more all out offensive options no real rebreeding needed.

 

212.gif-Scizor-
Where do I begin. This guy gets Technician, an ability that boosts all moves with less than 60BP by 1.5, meaning his Quick Attack would have 60BP instead of 40 however he also gets Bullet Punch which coupled with STAB it gets around 90BP on a priority move, that's more than ExtremeSpeed, He also gets U-Turn, a STAB physical bug type move that lets him hit hard while pivoting away from potential threats like Magnezone making him a great Choice Band user. But he also gets access to Roost for recovery so he can run a bulky set and set up and on top of that he gets Bug Bite, a 60 BP physical bug move that gets increased to 90BP. Basically this guy will be really common in OU and higher.
When it comes to it, its Choice Band Adamant Set will likely be the most common one. However all the Impish ones from UU won't necessarily be useless, its bulky set is still a fairly good late game win condition.

 

227.gif-Skarmory-
Gets Stealth Rock, Brave Bird and Tadaa! Roost as recovery, so yeah gone are the days of forcing it to use rest to punch holes through its team.
If you want Brave Bird then you gotta rebreed

 

080.gif-Slowbro-
Gets Trick Room which makes slower Pokemon move first.
No rebreeding needed

 

361.gif-Snorunt-
Gets an alternate evolution. Will likely require breeding from the start.

 

260.gif-Swampert-
Gets Avalanche which is a better option than Ice Punch for Curse sets. Also Stealth Rock.
Impish or relaxed swampert will likely be more common here however Careful Curse sets and Adamant/Jolly band sets will still be pretty hot.

 

121.gif-Starmie-

Still remains as one of the best spinners in the game, with the ability to punish spinblockers pretty heavily with its attacks and coverage. This generation will have faster and stronger pursuiters as well as the obnoxious Ferrothorn trying to punish it for spinning, however Starmie also gains access to the curious Reflect Type which allows it to copy the typing of the opposing Pokemon, meaning in the case of facing against Ferrothorn it can become Grass/Steel gaining a x4 resistance to grass and immunity to Leech Seed essentially making Ferrothorn way less punishing.

 

073.gif-Tentacruel-

It gets access to Scald like every non-ice water type as well as Toxic Spikes and in order to force opponents out it gets Acid Spray, a weak Poison damaging move that lowers the special defense of the opponent by two stages

 

324.gif-Torkoal-

If the fact that Pelipper gets Drizzle here is true, then Torkoal should be getting Drought, Groudon's signature ability as an ability, making it the bulkiest sun setter albeit not as good as the other weather setters. Also Stealth Rock.

 

248.gif-Tyranitar-
Gets Stone Edge and Stealth Rock, pretty much every change he got in gen4 was already implemented in MMO besides those two.

 

197.gif-Umbreon-

While still sporting the faults Umbreon always had, namely being a bad Blissey/Chansey, it gains Foul Play as a move, which allows it to deal pretty good damage to any Pokemon trying to set up Swords Dance or Dragon Dance on its face since it calculates its damage according to the Attack stat of the target rather than the user.

 

049.gif-Venomoth-

While outclassed by Volcarona in OU Venomoth has a few new tricks up its sleeve. Access to Quiver Dance which raises its Spatk Spdef and Speed all at once without any drawbacks, a better bug STAB with Bug Buzz and access to Tinted Lens as an ability, which allows it to deal double damage to Pokemon who resist the move used. Meaning something like Weezing would take damage from Bug Buzz and Sludge Bomb normally instead of resisting it and Crobat would only take 1/2 damage from Bug Buzz instead of 1/4.

 

003.gif-Venusaur-
Gains Energy Ball, leaf storm and fierce competition from Roserade, his super popular HP fire Growth set will probably be nicer on Roserade, though Roserade lacks physical bulk compared to Venusaur.

 

110.gif-Weezing-

Weezing will take a pretty hard hit from Rotom and will likely drop to lower tiers, however he won't be completely useless. It gains access to Toxic Spikes and its ability to Haze things like Conkeldurr is always welcome.

 

193.gif-Yanma-
Gets an evolution.

 

Gen4 viable Pokemon:
This is a small list of what I'd consider viable or useable without many drawbacks and a brief introduction of what they do.

 

460.gif-Abomasnow-
A grass/ice Pokemon might sound like the worst defensive typing in the world and a mediocre offensive typing. However its ability, Snow Warning can summon hail as soon as it enters the match, allowing it to rack up passive damage onto non-ice types, breaking sashes and it also has the advantage of switching into water types and electric types benching on their ice coverage to nail resists so not everything is lost for it. It also has mixed offenses, leech seed, ice shard and earthquake and that isn't so bad when it comes to coverage.

 

437.gif-Bronzong-
A fun defensive Steel/Psychic pivot who can set up rocks, raise Light Screen and Reflect or set up Trick Room without being Magnezone bait due to access to Earthquake and while having some nice offensive presence.
Its abilities are Heatproof(Halves damage from fire moves) and Levitate which forces people to guess which of these its carrying to hit it super effectively (90% will be levitate but you can play some mindgames).

 

395.gif-Empoleon-
Water/Steel pokemon who can fulfill both offensive and defensive roles.
It excels at defensive ones such as Rocks setting and phazing due to its amazing typing, sadly it lacks any real recovery.
It can utilize an Agility set that mixed with Substitute and Pataya berry it can function as a late game sweeper.

Keep in mind it's a starter that may not be implemented yet

 

477.gif-Dusknoir-
Dusclops' evolution, a borderline unnecessary evolution that does more or less the same as Dusclops always did, however it has a bit more offensive presence with 100 base Attack, access to elemental punches, Shadow Sneak and Earthquake.

 

466.gif-Electivire-
Electabuzz'ss's's evolution, its ability allows it to gain one stage of speed when hit by an electric attack and like Electabuzz it carries an amazing arsenal of coverage that can pretty much nail anything on the switch if predicting correctly. However its normal base speed is pretty average and it doesn't hit that hard if mispredicting.

 

478.gif-Froslass-
Snorunt's alternate evolution, Froslass is a curious pokemon, it has the stats and typing of a sweeper but a supportive movepool. Ghost/Ice Pokemon with access to 110 base speed, Taunt, Spikes, Will-O-Wisp, Destiny Bond and Thunder Wave it's a terrifying lead to fight against and will likely get away with either crippling your pokemon or setting up spikes. Its ability, Snow Cloak, synergizes with Abomasnow's Snow warning pretty well.

 

445.gif-Garchomp-
Before you spend a lot of money breeding this guy, wait to see if it gets banned first. If you ask seasoned Pokemon players who is the best pokemon overall across all generations most would respond either Tyranitar or Garchomp. This guy is an insane beast that can fulfill both defensive and offensive roles. He excels at offense, Scarf, Mixed, Bulky Rocks setter, Life Orb, Band, and yache berry. With 130 attack, 102 base speed, powerful STABs in Ground/Dragon and an ability that raises its evasion in the sand, Garchomp is arguably the strongest pokemon in the game.

Keep in mind Garchomp may not be released in this patch due to it being only attainable in gen4

 

475.gif-Gallade-
Kirlia's alternate evolution. A physically oriented Gardevoir, not much to say here, it has access to Shadow Sneak, Leaf Blade, Swords Dance, Will o Wisp, Wish and Heal Bell to differentiate it from Medicham.

 

423.gif-Gastrodon-
This generation's Water/Ground pokemon. Like the other Water/Ground Pokemon it's slow and bulky, this guy more on the Spdef aspect. Before breeding one, wait to see if its ability gets buffed to its gen5 version since it's marginally better. Its ability Storm Drain makes it immune to water, lets it gain Spatk when hit by a water move and redirects water moves to it in doubles.

 

472.gif-Gliscor-
Gligar's evolution. An overall better version of Gligar, has access to Stealth Rock, Defog, Roost and a bunch of new moves like Night Slash and U-Turn. With its great defensive typing and access to recovery Gliscor is a good pivot to play with and can also be a great Stallbreaker.

 

450.gif-Hippowdon-
If you ever wanted a safe switch to any electric type then Hippowdon is for you. This amazing Ground mixed wall not only has enough bulk to stomach and scare away any electric type out there (Besides Rotom) but he can also set up Stealth Rocks, phaze out and even has some nice coverage with Ice Fang, Stone Edge and Earthquake. Its ability is none other than Sand Stream, same as Tyranitar and synergizes well with Toxic if you decide to use it. The cherry on top of the cake is it gets access to Slack Off for recovery so you don't have to worry about being worn down. Legitimately one of the best walls in the game.

 

430.gif-Honchkrow-
Murkrow's evolution. It's a hard hitting Dark/Flying type with low speed and low defenses it can hit pretty hard physically and even run some mixed moves but speed is kind of a problem. It can set up with Swords Dance and also has priority with Sucker Punch (A move that fails if the opponent doesn't use an offensive move).    

 

392.gif-Infernape-
Fire/fighting mixed attacker Pokemon that overshadows Blaziken at pretty much everything (Until this one gets Speed Boost). It has 108 base speed, access to taunt, fake out, stealth rock, slack off, swords dance, nasty plot, u-turn, overheat, thunderpunch, grass knot, earthquake, close combat, stone edge, you name it. It can work as an offensive pivot, stallbreaker, wallbreaker, scarf sweeper, lead, and probably more.

Keep in mind it's a starter that may not be implemented yet

 

448.gif-Lucario-
Steel/fighting mixed attacker with access to both Swords Dance, Nasty Plot as well as Agility to remedy its kinda low speed. Doesn't carry the utility Infernape has but the superior defensive typing is welcome.

 

462.gif-Magnezone-
Magneton's evolution. It's literally Magneton but slower, bulkier, and hits a tad bit harder. Nothing much to say.

 

473.gif-Mamoswine-
Piloswine's evolution. Unlike the slow Piloswine with mediocre attack and defenses Mamoswine has a nice 80 base speed and an outstanding 130 base attack. Coupled with near unresisted STAB and amazing coverage it can function as a wallbreaker, lead and scarf sweeper. It gains access to Ice Shard for priority and Stealth rocks and is immune to both sand and hail, so if you feel like using Sash-Endeavor, it's pretty viable.

 

429.gif-Mismagius-
Misdreavus' evolution. Basically a worse Gengar in almost every way, not really by a huge margin though, it's a strong silver to Gengar's gold. However Mismagius has access to Nasty Plot which allows it to boost up its special attack. If Gengar remains banned though, here's a worthy replacement.

 

474.gif-Porygon-Z-
Porygon2's evolution. Porygon-Z is to Porygon2 what Zangoose is to a goose. Unlike the bulky, slow, stally Porygon2, Porygon-Z is pretty fast with 95 base speed and an amazing 135 base special attack. On top of that it gets two incredible abilities, Adaptability which makes STAB moves hit x2 instead of x1.5 and Download which raises either Attack or Special Attack one stage depending on which of the opponent's defenses is lower. It makes for a premier Scarf or Specs user but also has access to Agility and Nasty plot in case you want to boost with it.

 

464.gif-Rhyperior-
Rhydon's evolution. Basically a better Rhydon that hits hard as hell, has an ability that reduces Super Effective damage taken and is even bulkier (Eviolite Rhydon gives it some competition). It still melts to special attacks but now you can evolve this guy and get an amazing physical bruiser that doesn't mind taking an earthquake. Needless to say it also gets Stealth Rock, Stone Edge and Rock Polish to raise its speed.

 

407.gif-Roserade-
Roselia's evolution. This evolution is akin to a slightly more offensive Venusaur but with access to Spikes and Toxic Spikes, it has a nice 90 base speed and can hit pretty hard as well as run a somewhat specially bulky set, Natural Cure allows it to set up on Chansey with Growth without worrying about Thunder Wave.

 

479.gif479-c.gif479-h.gif-Rotom-479-w.gif479-s.gif479-f.gif
Remember Weezing? Well he's your new Weezing but now Ghost/Electric. Bulky Levitating special attacking pokemon that carries Will-O-Wisp, uses pain split and has electric coverage. However unlike Weezing he can also rock some mean offensive sets with either Scarf or Specs.

Rotom works in a strange way. It has different forms you can access if you fuse it with a certain appliance you find in in a certain building. Depending on which appliance you fuse it to, said appliance will allow it to use a specific move of the type said appliance represents. and also change its typing to the type of that move Rotom-Wash(Hydro Pump), Rotom-Heat(Overheat), Rotom-Mow(Leaf Storm), Rotom-Fan(Air Slash), Rotom-Frost(Blizzard)

Keep in mind Rotom will be obtained as a trade and therefore will likely be a gift with fixed IVs and Nature

 

442.gif-Spiritomb-
Ghost/Dark Pokemon with pretty good bulk and offenses yet kind of slow. A good pursuit user, with access to Will-O-Wisp, Pain Split, Shadow Sneak,Sucker Punch and Calm Mind for special sets. Its typing means it has no weakness so it's a pretty safe pick.

 

398.gif-Staraptor-
Crowned Miss Borderline 4 gens in a row Staraptor is basically a Flying Tauros with less bulk. 100 base speed, Intimidate, access to Double Edge, Brave Bird, Return, U-Turn and to break steels and rocks it gets Close Combat. Can rock a scarf set, a band set and even a non choice set with Roost.

 

468.gif-Togekiss-
Togetic's evolution also the most annoying thing to face in the world. Togekiss has a nice 80 base speed as well as pretty solid bulk and special attack. Togekiss can sport many different sets, it gets Nasty Plot, Roost, Heal Bell for utility and for coverage it gets Flamethrower, Tri-Attack and Aura Sphere (Special 80BP fighting move that never misses), however what makes Togekiss annoying is its ability, Serene Grace which doubles the chance of secondary effects happening. This coupled with its main STAB, Air Slash with the ability to make you flinch 30% of the time and the fact that it learns Thunder Wave it means you have a very large chance of being para-flinched to death unless you're an electric type.

 

461.gif-Weavile-
Sneasel's evolution. Basically a faster, harder hitting Sneasel. It has access to Night Slash for a Dark type STAB instead of bite and it also gets Ice Shard for priority to deal with those scarf Flygons. You will have to rebreed it with a Beartic in order to access its best Ice Type move, Icicle Crash.

 

469.gif-Yanmega-
Yanma's evolution. A rare case where both abilities are really good. You can choose Speed Boost to basically gain speed and become harder to revenge kill or use the deadly Tinted Lens which makes it so not very effective hits deal double damage, essentially turning it into a deadly wallbreaker with specs. The main downside is its massive x4 weakness to Stealth Rock and while it can break through any non Chansey/Blissey wall it is extremely susceptible to priority.

 

Gen5 Viable Pokemon

594.gif-Alomomola-
A Water Pokemon with no real offensive presence but with access to a massive HP stat, Wish, and Regenerator as a hidden ability, an ability that restores 30% of its massive HP by switching out.

 

591.gif-Amoonguss-
Grass Poison shroom Pokemon. Like all Shroom Pokemon it gains access to Spore but unlike Parasect this guy is useful. With decent bulk, access to the previously introduced Regenerator also as a hidden ability and access to Clear Smog to remove stat boosts from opponents he becomes a great pivot. He also has access to Rage Powder to redirect attacks to him in doubles.

 

625.gif-Bisharp-
Steel/Dark Pokemon that packs a punch, not as much as he does in gen6 but worth mentioning.His ability, Defiant makes so if one of his attacks is lowered he gains a x2 boost to attack, meaning Intimidating it does more harm than good in this case.

 

609.gif-Chandelure-
Fire/Ghost Pokemon with Flash Fire, 145 base spatk, Calm Mind and a decent speed tier. Has access to the usual ghost tricks such as Will o Wisp and Pain Split as well as good coverage with Energy Ball.

563.gif-Cofagrigus-
Really bulky ghost. Think of it as Dusclops 2.5 has access to Toxic Spikes and a strange ability in Mummy which replaces the ability of anything making contact with it ruining the day for Poison Healers and Huge Power users.

 

534.gif-Conkeldurr-
Machamp 2.0. With access to three great abilities in Guts, Iron First and Sheer Force as well as amazing coverage, access to priority, boosting moves in Bulk Up, good synergy with Drain Punch and amazing HP, Atk and Def stats this guy is an incredibly scary bruiser.

555.gif-Darmanitan-
A supremely scary fire type offensive pivot with Sheer Force, 145 atk, Flare Blitz, U-Turn and enough coverage to deal decent damage to anything. It can punch holes into anything that doesnt resist it and outspeed a lot of things with a Scarf.

530.gif-Excadrill-
Excadrill is a really versatile pokemon. Steel/Ground typing make it immune to Toxic and Thunder Wave. It can work as an amazing late game sweeper with either a scarf or under the sand with Sand Rush, it can use rapid spin and he can also hit Levitators with his Earthquake and set up rocks and Toxic through Magic Bouncers if it has Mold Breaker.

598.gif-Ferrothorn-
Forretress 2.0 but this time it's Grass/Steel and has more balanced defenses. With access to Stealth Rock, Spikes, Leech Seed and Thunder Wave, Ferrothorn is a pain to deal with. Most spinners trying to Spin on its face will take damage from his Iron Barbs, a renamed Rough Skin.

 

612.gif-Haxorus-
147 atk, 97 speed, Dragon Dance. This Dragon will tear holes through pretty much any team after dancing just once, it can also rock the scarf or band set like all other Dragon Dancers and sports enough coverage to make the average wall cry..

635.gif-Hydreigon-
Hydreigon walks into a bar, there is no counter. This Dragon/Dark Pokemon has 0 counters, and nothing can switch in safely into every single one of its sets. Will likely be banned but only time will tell. It may not be able to learn Dark Pulse on release

593.gif-Jellicent-
Water/Ghost special pokemon, meaning it has access to both Scald and Will-O-Wisp, having more tools to burn than most actual fire types. It's pretty bulky, has access to Recover, Taunt and Water Absorb, meaning you can spinblock, Defogblock and scaldblock at the same time.

553.gif-Krookodile-
Dark/Ground physical threat with Intimidate and Moxie. Has a nice speed tier and is a great offensive Stealth Rocks

 

549.gif-Lilligant

Not as strong as the rest mentioned here (Except maybe Seismitoad) but worth mentioning. Pure grass with access to Quiver Dance. Sleep induction in Sleep Power+Quiver Dance is always worth mentioning. Bellosom can do a similar thing but it's downright outclassed by Lilligant.

630.gif-Mandibuzz-
Almost the polar opposite of its fellow Dark/Flying Honchcrow. Mandibuzz is pretty bulky, has access to Foul Play(Dark type 90 BP physical move that makes use of the opponent's attack stat instead of its own), Whirlwind, and Defog. Nothing too special but has nice utility.

620.gif-Mienshao-
Mienshao is a fighting type has access to Regenerator and U-Turn as well as a nice speed tier that allows it to pivot offensively into a lot of threats and deal some pretty good damage. Its Hidden Ability, Reckless, also boosts its High Jump Kick to insane levels of damage.

579.gif-Reuniclus-
A really slow and really bulky Psychic type with enough tools to change entire games around. It has Magic Guard which makes him immune to non direct damage, meaning Toxic, Sand, Hail and entry Hazards don't affect him and he can use Life Orb without recoil damage. If that doesn't tickle you fancy then it also has access to Regenerator for even more recovery.
He also has access to Calm Mind, Recover, Trick Room and enough coverage to punish any switch. Oh and Psyshock to make Chansey and Blissey cry for mommy.

545.gif-Scolipede-
As a standalone pokemon it's kinda unimpressive, specially with its Bug/Poison typing but if in a situation where Baton Pass is allowed it becomes really scary. With Speed Boost(lmao Quick Feet, sorry everyone), Baton Pass, the ability to pass Iron Defense, Swords Dance and also a nice amount of coverage to scare common threats away, you better pack a phazer when trying to get Mewtwo or Rayquaza.

560.gif-Scrafty-
Dark/fighting Pokemon. Has access to Dragon Dance, Shed Skin to cure status problems, Intimidate+ Fake out for doubles and Moxie if you like snowballing. Has good coverage too.

537.gif-Seismitoad-
I don't think Seismitoad is good or special but I've seen it used enough that I'd feel wrong not sticking it here.
Bulky Water/Ground Pokemon with Water Absorb as a Hidden Ability, Scald and stealth rocks. That's it.

497.gif-Serperior-
With access to Contrary, Serperior becomes a beast capable of boosting its SpAtk by two stages by spamming the 140 BP Leaf Storm, it has a nice 108 base speed however it has as much spatk as Oddish and is completely useless without its Hidden Ability so make sure it's implemented before breeding one.

637.gif-Volcarona-
My favorite Pokemon. A fire/bug with one of the best boosting moves in the game, Quiver Dance, which raises its already high Spatk, decent Spdef and base 100 Speed by one stage. It has access to enough coverage to nail most common switch ins and Flame Body will punish any contact moves by burning them. However it has a x4 weakness to Stealth Rock and really needs to remove certain checks to sweep teams.

547.gif-Whimsicott-
Jumpluff 2.0 except just Grass. With access to Prankster it can use any non-offensive move with priority. It can either set up weather again, activate tailwind, encore you into boosting or setting up hazards or even taunt you before you can do anything. Pretty annoying and fast but lacks offense.

571.gif-Zoroark-
Dark type. If implemented correctly Zoroark's gimmick is the ability to look like the last pokemon in your party, meaning if you have Ferrothorn as your last Pokemon but you send out Zoroark, your opponent might send out Magneton into a powerful and unexpected Flamethrower. Besides that, it has decent speed and offenses as well as both Swords Dance and Nasty Plot and somewhat good coverage but it mostly relies on his gimmick to nail unsuspecting victims.

 

 

Pokemon that become way stronger with the addition of gen5's Hidden abilities.

065.gif-Alakazam-
Magic Guard makes it take damage only from direct attacks, meaning Poison, entry hazards, Life Orb recoil don't damage it, making it an ideal Pokemon to hold a Focus Sash.

257.gif-Blaziken-
Speed Boost turns this scary wallbreaker into a powerful sweeper. Will likely get banned to ubers.

286.gif-Breloom-
Technician makes its Mach Punch hit as hard as Scizor's Bullet Punch, boosts Low Sweep and makes a 5 hit Bullet Seed the hardest hitting move in the tier.

036.gif-Clefable-
Unaware makes it ignore the stat boosts of your opponent and allow you to wall them without fear of a sweep.

342.gif-Crawdaunt-
Adaptability boosts its STAB damage by 2x instead of 1.5x. With access to Aqua Jet it can hit pretty hard

132.gif-Ditto-
Imposter makes it transform into whatever the opponent has out instantly, great for revenge killing a boosting pokemon. Useless if they are behind a sub though.

149.gif-Dragonite-
MultiScale makes it so all damage it takes when at full hp is reduced by half, giving it more set up options.

196.gif-Espeon-
Magic Bounce bounces back status moves and entry hazards to the opposing side

160.gif-Feraligatr-
Sheer Force boosts its damage to disgusting levels, on top of that it no longer gets recoil from Life Orb while originally considered a shitty Gyarados, its damage far surpasses Gyarados if holding a life orb

207.gif-Gligar-
Immunity is nice for walling, also Eviolite boosts its defenses by 1.5.

472.gif-Gliscor-
Poison Heal makes this guy unkillable by chip damage, holding a Toxic Orb and with access to roost, he becomes a deadly stallbreaker.

130.gif-Gyarados-
Moxie raises its attack by one stage with every KO it gets, turning into a very snowbally Pokemon after one DD or two.

214.gif-Heracross-
Same as Gyarados, its scarf set is now more spammable

106.gif-Hitmonlee-

Unburden makes it so after it loses its item it becomes twice as fast.

034.gif-Nidoking-
Same as Feraligatr, Sheer Force makes Nidoking deal obscene damage along with having an immunity to Life Orb's recoil.

031.gif-Nidoqueen-
Same as Nidoking

038.gif-Ninetales-
Ninetales gets Drought, previously Groudon's signature ability which causes Sunny Weather to appear immediately for 5 turns.

186.gif-Politoed-
Politoed gets Drizzle, previously Kyogre's signature ability which causes Rainy Weather to appear immediately for 5 turns.

195.gif-Quagsire-
Same as Clefable. Unaware turns it into a nice wall for boosters.

302.gif-Sableye-
Prankster makes it so all his non-attacking moves have priority, meaning Recover and Will-O-Wisp gain priority.

373.gif-Salamence-
Same as Heracross and Gyarados.

319.gif-Sharpedo-
Speed boost. Though less powerful than Blaziken and will likely remain UU/OU, he turns into a deadly sweeper.

080.gif-Slowbro-
Regenerator makes it so Slowbro regains 1/3 of his health just by switching out, turning into a hard to break pivot and a full stop for many Pokemon.

398.gif-Staraptor-
Reckless boosts the damage of Double Edge and Brave Bird by 20% making it deal a lot of damage.

 465.gif-Tangrowth-
Same as Slowbro

157.gif-Typhlosion-
Flash fire boosts its already powerful fire moves

003.gif-Venusaur-
Chlorophyll boosts its speed under the sun, if you boost with Growth and have some sun turns to spare then you're good to go.

 

Moves added in Gen 4
https://pokemondb.net/move/generation/4

Best move: Stealth Rocks

Moves added in Gen5
https://pokemondb.net/move/generation/5

Best move: Scald

Notable new items:

Air Balloon: Makes it so until the Pokemon is hit by a damaging move, it is immune to ground type moves.

Effectiveness halving Berries: They basically half the damage of a super effective move hitting your Pokemon, meaning an Ice Beam hitting a Venusaur holding a Yache Berry will do x1 damage, while an Ice Beam hitting a Dragonite holding a Yache Berry will do x2 damage. Consumed after use

Elemental Gems: Boost the damage of the first type matching move used by x1.5. Consumed after use

Eviolite: This item makes every non fully evolved Pokemon holding it have x1.5 defenses, making them decently bulky.

Flame Orb: Burns the holder at the end of the turn.

Focus Sash: This item makes it so if the holding Pokemon has full health and takes enough damage to be OHKO'd then it survives with 1 hp. Think of it as Sturdy but it's consumed after use.

Light Clay: Makes Reflect and Light Screen last 8 turns instead of 5.

Power Herb: Makes two turn charging moves take only one turn. It's consumed after one use.

Rocky Helmet: Deals 1/16 hp damage to any Pokemon hitting the holder with a contact move

Toxic Orb: Badly poisons the holder at the end of the turn.

Weather Enhancing Items: Make weather summoned by moves or abilities last 8 turns instead of 5.

 

 

 

Edited by suigin
fuck whoever thought adding captcha was a good idea

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Awesome guide for someone who knows nothing of gen4-5, It's hard to try to master 2 new gens at once, I would have preferred if they were to implement 1 gen at a time, but yeah this guide will definitely help for a start.

I just hope I don't end up giving up on that game though, knowing that I'll have to grind for a lifetime, and breeding endlessly to get to own all these pokes.

Devs, please go easy on us.

kevola likes this

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I'm sure Pokémon Showdown can also help if you spectate games or check out the pokes itself through teambuilding. Anyways nice guide for those who don't know.

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12 hours ago, suigin said:

113.gif-Chansey-
 It also gets to use Eviolite, an item that boosts its defenses by 1.5, meaning it becomes almost as bulky as Swampert

 

I stopped reading here.

Someone tell me, is the rest of the post as bullshit as this line?

 

On another note, u tell us most comps arent going to be useless.

I find it fun cause ppl complain about chansey walling half the tier, without the eviolite we might possess in the future.

Unless half of new mons are banned to ubers, or our current OU drops to UU, I foresee a disaster.

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4 hours ago, pachima said:

I stopped reading here.

Someone tell me, is the rest of the post as bullshit as this line?

 

On another note, u tell us most comps arent going to be useless.

I find it fun cause ppl complain about chansey walling half the tier, without the eviolite we might possess in the future.

Unless half of new mons are banned to ubers, or our current OU drops to UU, I foresee a disaster.

Yeah I meant to say almost as physically bulky sorry

 

252+ Atk Manaphy Waterfall vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 82-97 (25.1 - 29.7%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252+ Atk Manaphy Waterfall vs. 240 HP / 252+ Def Swampert: 49-58 (23.9 - 28.2%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery

 

 

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1 minute ago, suigin said:

Yeah I meant to say almost as physically bulky sorry

 

252+ Atk Manaphy Waterfall vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 82-97 (25.1 - 29.7%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252+ Atk Manaphy Waterfall vs. 240 HP / 252+ Def Swampert: 49-58 (23.9 - 28.2%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery

 

 

 

sry if I sounded too rude. Anyway, as I said before this gen´s success will entirely depend on the way they will implement it. From my perspective, implementing gradually some pokemon every month or something would be the way to go. If they suddenly implement all at once, you can be sure we will be spending two years just to tierize every pokemon.

As a comparison, snorlax itself was reason to months of discussion and thrown chairs. Now we will have a gen where even snorlax is irrelevant at higher tiers. I don´t think ppl here can handle the decisions that are yet to come all at once.

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Personally I feel like the meta being gradually updated over time is good to avoid stagnation. I assume some of the quickbans are gonna be stuff like Azumarill and Garchomp but everything else taking a while to tier will make the meta more dynamic.

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nice guide overall  :) GJ

 

Just some mentions: Dragon Dance flygon is from gen 7, maybe not implemented.

 

Draco meteor, leaf storm have 140 power instead of 120 tough were nerfed to 130 in gen 7.

 

Zoroark could be awesome if they didnt implement team preview at the start.

 

DAMNN THIS META RESET 'LL BE AWSUM!!1

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14 minutes ago, Risadex said:

nice guide overall  :) GJ

 

Just some mentions: Dragon Dance flygon is from gen 7, maybe not implemented.

 

Draco meteor, leaf storm have 140 power instead of 120 tough were nerfed to 130 in gen 7.

 

Zoroark could be awesome if they didnt implement team preview at the start.

 

DAMNN THIS META RESET 'LL BE AWSUM!!1

Dragon Dance Flygon will likely be implemented since MMO learnpools match gen7's (For example Gyarados learns Crunch here and in gen6 but it can't in any previous gen)

Thanks for correcting me with Leaf Storm though.

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12 minutes ago, suigin said:

Dragon Dance Flygon will likely be implemented since MMO learnpools match gen7's (For example Gyarados learns Crunch here and in gen6 but it can't in any previous gen)

Thanks for correcting me with Leaf Storm though.

yeah, my mistake. i tought it was acquired from a special event or some stuff like that. Thats insane.

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Posted (edited)

conckeldurr is one of the most bastards poke especially if is played with the assault vest

honchkrow ye is a nice pokemon and have access to sucker punch and if you kill a pokemon with that priority u can boost the atk with moxie but don't think in OU doing good

Venomoth gonna be the volcarona 2.0 in UU.

Edited by DarylDixon

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I think Honchkrow can have a nice place in NU, who knows. 

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Can you add spoiler for each pokemon to find an specific pokemon?

Overall a very good guide, tysm

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2 hours ago, xStarr said:

I think Honchkrow can have a nice place in NU, who knows. 

Honchkrow is the poke I've been waiting for the most.

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It's worth noting that learnsets have been updated to include moves learned in generation 7 (if they existed in gen 5), giving Dodrio access to Swords Dance and many other Pokemon some extra moves.

 

It's also possible that we'll implement generation 7 abilities (if the ability existed in gen 5). Cursed Body on Gengar (replaces Levitate), Drizzle on Pelipper (extra normal ability), and Drought on Torkoal (extra normal ability) are the ones that affect currently obtainable Pokemon. Gen 4-5 Pokemon also have potential extra abilities. None of this is guaranteed however.

 

Like existing Pokemon, gen 4-5 Pokemon have also received any stat buffs they were given in generation 6 or 7.

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2 hours ago, RacheLucario said:

Cursed Body on Gengar (replaces Levitate)

Replaces?? Dont gonna be an option to keep levitate w abilty pills?

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31 minutes ago, KoolT93 said:

Replaces?? Dont gonna be an option to keep levitate w abilty pills?

Gengar only has 1 ability in gen 7. Being Cursed Body. Making them have both wouldn't make sense since we still have stuff based on different generations. If 1 ability of a pokemon were to become gen 7 and the other generation 2 or even both on the same pokemon. That would make it really confusing and as I said it just wouldn't make sense at all. Besides, Cursed Body Gengar really isn't that terrible.

 

Then again this might not happen at all as Rachel said. So let's not throw a fit untill we actually have the update.

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26 minutes ago, TheChampionMike said:

Besides, Cursed Body Gengar really isn't that terrible.

Insert "Are you sure about that" meme

Cursed body on Gengar sucks, since it dies easily, and as cursed body does NOT guarantee to disable the enemy contact move, is just basically thrash unless you skill swap it to any bulky pokemon (say blissey for example)

LifeStyle likes this

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Just now, Zigh said:

Insert "Are you sure about that" meme

Cursed body on Gengar sucks, since it dies easily, and as cursed body does NOT guarantee to disable the enemy contact move, is just basically thrash unless you skill swap it to any bulky pokemon (say blissey for example)

It has stopped me from sweeping many times when I was locked into a choice item in gen 7. It's not as good as levitate I agree. But it is also not useless.

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Gengar losing Levitate basically just means it can no longer pivot into Ground moves, but can now clean up Toxic Spikes (Which will become a thing in MMO after gen5 update).

It will be pretty interesting how our meta will consist of having Gen7 movepools without the Gen7 pokes.

I wonder if moves like Knock Off and Leech Life will be upgraded to Gen7 mechanics tho, also the chance of getting hit by confusion / Thunder Wave Accuracy / Paralyze nerf / etc.

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3 hours ago, LifeStyle said:

Gengar losing Levitate basically just means it can no longer pivot into Ground moves, but can now clean up Toxic Spikes (Which will become a thing in MMO after gen5 update).

It will be pretty interesting how our meta will consist of having Gen7 movepools without the Gen7 pokes.

I wonder if moves like Knock Off and Leech Life will be upgraded to Gen7 mechanics tho, also the chance of getting hit by confusion / Thunder Wave Accuracy / Paralyze nerf / etc.

I'm looking at the possibility of introducing Generation 7 status changes, mostly to negate the centralization of scald.

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Posted (edited)

I know it would take a long time, but we could possibly include all the new moves each pokemon would get access to in the guide

, e.g. Bellosom Quiver dance etc

Edited by Matoka

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