Bilburt Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 18 minutes ago, suigin said: Because a Mixed sweeper is supposed to surprise and lure someone into sending something to wall it just to have their weak points attacked right after. Nobody in their right mind would send a Chansey to wall a Blaziken, they'd send a bulky water type instead. Thats why you combine a mixed blaziken with venu besides not every blaziken you see is mixed there are more setd on blaziken that are viable then just mixed that is what it gives a surprise factor Link to comment
Bestfriends Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Just now, Erayne said: Wow. Are you serious? Its like saying, well it NEVER rains under my watch. You don't take the time to look at the forecast before you drive off to work. You come back and it rains and you have no umbrella, your not prepared. Same for chansey, if you feel that a starmie has trick, switch into a wall you don't care about like umbreon and let the star use trick. You just thwarted off the trick threat. Lets call this the bounce effect... Frags has a Gyarodos and I pull in a starmie. Frags is usually ahead of the curve, so he switches into umbreon (calm) and I use trick. I laugh at him, but he has the last laugh and switches into chansey. The bounce effect can easily throw a trick user off his/her game. Link to comment
Erayne Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Just now, Bestfriends said: Its like saying, well it NEVER rains under my watch. You don't take the time to look at the forecast before you drive off to work. You come back and it rains and you have no umbrella, your not prepared. Same for chansey, if you feel that a starmie has trick, switch into a wall you don't care about like umbreon and let the star use trick. You just thwarted off the trick threat. Lets call this the bounce effect... Frags has a Gyarodos and I pull in a starmie. Frags is usually ahead of the curve, so he switches into umbreon (calm) and I use trick. I laugh at him, but he has the last laugh and switches into chansey. The bounce effect can easily throw a trick user off his/her game. so i should bring an umbreon? Best strategy ever Link to comment
Bestfriends Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Just now, Erayne said: so i should bring an umbreon? Best strategy ever If your concerned about the over usage of trick, yes. If people wise up to the bounce effect, no. Link to comment
pachima Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 4 minutes ago, Bestfriends said: Its like saying, well it NEVER rains under my watch. You don't take the time to look at the forecast before you drive off to work. You come back and it rains and you have no umbrella, your not prepared. Same for chansey, if you feel that a starmie has trick, switch into a wall you don't care about like umbreon and let the star use trick. You just thwarted off the trick threat. Lets call this the bounce effect... Frags has a Gyarodos and I pull in a starmie. Frags is usually ahead of the curve, so he switches into umbreon (calm) and I use trick. I laugh at him, but he has the last laugh and switches into chansey. The bounce effect can easily throw a trick user off his/her game. That seems player´s fault, not pokemon neither items. Bestfriends 1 Link to comment
suigin Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 3 minutes ago, Bilburt said: Thats why you combine a mixed blaziken with venu besides not every blaziken you see is mixed there are more setd on blaziken that are viable then just mixed that is what it gives a surprise factor We're talking specifically about the viability of Mixed Sweepers vs Chansey since it was said that they'd beat Chansey 1v1. So far the only one mentioned that can OHKO Chansey with Superpower is Blaziken and even then Chansey won't switch into Blaziken to wall its special attacks. Saying Mixed sweepers beat Chansey is kinda silly since the only Mixed sweeper that does beat her is a mixed variation of a Pokemon she'll never switch into anyways. Link to comment
Bilburt Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Tricky will always be a tricky move (pun intended) I always hate having to switch in a poke knowing its gonna be tricked you have no way of knowing whats gonna be tricked on (special band does seem to be used a lot) and if you let a pokemon got tricked its crippled for the rest of the match its only use is sacking in the end it doesnt matter what pokemon you let get tricked, you always end up with a almost useless pokemln Link to comment
Bilburt Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 1 minute ago, suigin said: We're talking specifically about the viability of Mixed Sweepers vs Chansey since it was said that they'd beat Chansey 1v1. So far the only one mentioned that can OHKO Chansey with Superpower is Blaziken and even then Chansey won't switch into Blaziken to wall its special attacks. Saying Mixed sweepers beat Chansey is kinda silly since the only Mixed sweeper that does beat her is a mixed variation of a Pokemon she'll never switch into anyways. What is bad about the fact that you dont allow chansey to get used? Link to comment
DrButler Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 7 minutes ago, Erayne said: so i should bring an umbreon? Best strategy ever umbreon + chansey actually Erayne 1 Link to comment
suigin Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 1 minute ago, Bilburt said: What is bad about the fact that you dont allow chansey to get used? Because it's a bad argument that includes all mixed sweepers in the category of pokemon that can beat Chansey when in reality the only mixed sweeper that beats Chansey is Blaziken, a Pokemon who can beat Chansey with any of its sets. Link to comment
Bilburt Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Just now, suigin said: Because it's a bad argument that includes all mixed sweepers in the category of pokemon that can beat Chansey when in reality the only mixed sweeper that beats Chansey is Blaziken, a Pokemon who can beat Chansey with any of its sets. So ur saying I should have said blaziken instead of mixed sweepers? Link to comment
OrangeManiac Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Let's be real here. Umbreon is not D rank for fuck sakes. Yeah it's not a special wall unlike noobs tend to make it sound but it's still a solid Wish supporter with a niche to Pursuit trap Starmie from spinning and Haunter from spinblocking. Considering how big part of the metagame Spikes are I would rank Umbreon B- at absolute minimum. Maelstrom, RysPicz, Bestfriends and 3 others 6 Link to comment
KaynineXL Posted January 4, 2017 Author Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 minute ago, suigin said: Because it's a bad argument that includes all mixed sweepers in the category of pokemon that can beat Chansey when in reality the only mixed sweeper that beats Chansey is Blaziken, a Pokemon who can beat Chansey with any of its sets. Charizard, Electabuzz, Metagross, Flygon, Ludicolo, Sceptile are some mixed or rather sp attacks that can actually be physical that can beat Chansey. Bestfriends and Erayne 2 Link to comment
Bilburt Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 minute ago, KaynineXL said: Charizard, Electabuzz, Metagross, Flygon, Ludicolo, Sceptile are some mixed or rather sp attacks that can actually be physical that can beat Chansey. He was talking about ohko Link to comment
DoubleJ Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 2 hours ago, Frag said: marowak SS coz i like it Jupiter's uguu when? Frag 1 Link to comment
pachima Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 4 minutes ago, suigin said: Because it's a bad argument that includes all mixed sweepers in the category of pokemon that can beat Chansey when in reality the only mixed sweeper that beats Chansey is Blaziken, a Pokemon who can beat Chansey with any of its sets. 252+ Atk Life Orb Flygon Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Chansey: 317-374 (88.7 - 104.7%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO 252+ Atk Life Orb Swampert Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Chansey: 338-398 (94.6 - 111.4%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO I honestly wanted to know where you found that blazi is the only mixed that can ohko chansey. Second point: A mixed doesnt need to ohko chansey to beat her. Third point: 252 hp chansey is bad, period. Lastly: even flail vaporeon 2hkoes that shit. notmudkip0 and Bilburt 2 Link to comment
Bilburt Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 3 minutes ago, OrangeManiac said: Let's be real here. Umbreon is not D rank for fuck sakes. Yeah it's not a special wall unlike noobs tend to make it sound but it's still a solid Wish supporter with a niche to Pursuit trap Starmie from spinning and Haunter from spinblocking. Considering how big part of the metagame Spikes are I would rank Umbreon B- at absolute minimum. Idk its main weakness has always been that you could easily set up and that makes it very dangerous to use Link to comment
suigin Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 minute ago, Bilburt said: He was talking about ohko OHKO or maybe a 2HKO without Chansey inflicting status crippling them for the rest of the match. Link to comment
Bilburt Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 minute ago, suigin said: OHKO or maybe a 2HKO without Chansey inflicting status crippling them for the rest of the match. A lot of mixed sweepers can 2hko and rely on a heal beller to bring them back in the field even then killing chansey can be worth a sweeper Link to comment
suigin Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 minute ago, pachima said: 252+ Atk Life Orb Flygon Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Chansey: 317-374 (88.7 - 104.7%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO 252+ Atk Life Orb Swampert Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Chansey: 338-398 (94.6 - 111.4%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO I honestly wanted to know where you found that blazi is the only mixed that can ohko chansey. Second point: A mixed doesnt need to ohko chansey to beat her. Third point: 252 hp chansey is bad, period. Lastly: even flail vaporeon 2hkoes that shit. Yeah those sick 252+ atk mixed attackers Link to comment
pachima Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 minute ago, suigin said: Yeah those sick 252+ atk mixed attackers 252 hp chansey is way worse than 252 atk mixeds. Bilburt 1 Link to comment
KaynineXL Posted January 4, 2017 Author Share Posted January 4, 2017 (edited) 14 minutes ago, OrangeManiac said: Let's be real here. Umbreon is not D rank for fuck sakes. Yeah it's not a special wall unlike noobs tend to make it sound but it's still a solid Wish supporter with a niche to Pursuit trap Starmie from spinning and Haunter from spinblocking. Considering how big part of the metagame Spikes are I would rank Umbreon B- at absolute minimum. Don't take that D rank too serious, it was semi-joke. It was in the C section before I decided to put it there for the lols(hence the comment on 1st page) - I'd change it when we sort out more ranks. If we want to be real though, its only niche is to pursuit trap. It's so costly using it though, you can do absolutely nothing to Metagross along with many other threats actually. It's not great at walling a lot of special attackers such as Wish/Growth Jolteon & Venusaur. Actually, now that I read the definitions of each rank, it does sound like D rank. Edited January 4, 2017 by KaynineXL Bestfriends, RysPicz, xXBlu3BreathXx and 1 other 4 Link to comment
suigin Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 2 minutes ago, pachima said: 252 hp chansey is way worse than 252 atk mixeds. It isn't if you wanna lure nerds into eating Counters. Link to comment
Bilburt Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 minute ago, suigin said: It isn't if you wanna lure nerds into eating Counters. Why would you want to waste a slot on counter? Erayne 1 Link to comment
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