PvP Update

[codylramey]

Will this 100% be taking the place of the staff run tournies that we all know and love and usually cant get into.

[Squirtle]

Will this 100% be taking the place of the staff run tournies that we all know and love and usually cant get into.

 

Staff run tournies will use the same system but are not part of the unranked or ranked pvp system or monthly tournies. The current staff run events will turn into automated events that have specific set of rules depending on what the host of the Tourney wants.

[lCatanic]

Wow, this is really nice, the matchmaking was thinked really nice.

I dont know something, when will this update come to the server?

TY

[bl0nde]

• The top 128 Ranked players are eligible to enter into Automated Tournaments every month.
• Automated Tournaments are Single Elimination, Single Battles OU tournaments with configurable Shiny prizes.

 

I haven't played on the test server yet so I can only speculate on how this automated tournament works. However, I would suggest that at every stage of the bracket your opponent is randomized. For example: when there are 6 players remaining in a tournament, those remaining 6 are arranging to duel each other in a random fashion, not in a predetermined set bracket order. This eliminates people from scouting players so hard in a bracket prior to a duel (with the exception being the last final round).

[Rendiz]

What is the starting mmr?

[codylramey]

Will the automated system allow for bigger brackets?

[Munya]

What is the starting mmr?

 

500

 

 

• The top 128 Ranked players are eligible to enter into Automated Tournaments every month.
• Automated Tournaments are Single Elimination, Single Battles OU tournaments with configurable Shiny prizes.

 

I haven't played on the test server yet so I can only speculate on how this automated tournament works. However, I would suggest that at every stage of the bracket your opponent is randomized. For example: when there are 6 players remaining in a tournament, those remaining 6 are arranging to duel each other in a random fashion, not in a predetermined set bracket order. This eliminates people from scouting players so hard in a bracket prior to a duel (with the exception being the last final round).

 

 

I do like this idea, though if it doesn't become a thing players are given 10 minutes to prepare for there next match, provided there opponent is ready, they could technically swap up there team.

[bl0nde]

10 minutes or 1 minute is irrelevant. You either have multiple teams ready to go or you don't when you're at a tournament.

 

If it takes 10 minutes for you to pick your team you could be:

A. Piecing together a team one pokemon at a time and probably using scouting information from spectating.

B. Borrowing pokemon from friends to fight against someone.

C. At the very least taking 10 minutes implies you are saying to yourself "this guy likes to run this and these and usually follows this playstyle" and piecing together what you feel are counters.

 

The counter argument is that you can just take something unusual for yourself and then the people who have scouted you are less likely to have success against you. This doesn't change the fact that a randomizer for the matches creates the most even playing field available to us, i.e. no chance for lame "we scouted your teams" duels. It also lets the new guys that want in the scene with only one team have a chance too since you couldn't just watch them once then bring the counters and take them out second round. I'm sure we've had guys from pokemon showdown come here who are good duelists but only bother for grinding one team. You'd need to breed another team or at least things to switch out to have a chance against our scouters and veterans - yeah, that's an unnecessary entry barrier for our huge 70 person competitive scene.

[Gunthug]

10 minutes or 1 minute is irrelevant. You either have multiple teams ready to go or you don't when you're at a tournament.

 

If it takes 10 minutes for you to pick your team you could be:

A. Piecing together a team one pokemon at a time and probably using scouting information from spectating.

B. Borrowing pokemon from friends to fight against someone.

C. At the very least taking 10 minutes implies you are saying to yourself "this guy likes to run this and these and usually follows this playstyle" and piecing together what you feel are counters.

 

The counter argument is that you can just take something unusual for yourself and then the people who have scouted you are less likely to have success against you. This doesn't change the fact that a randomizer for the matches creates the most even playing field available to us, i.e. no chance for lame "we scouted your teams" duels. It also lets the new guys that want in the scene with only one team have a chance too since you couldn't just watch them once then bring the counters and take them out second round. I'm sure we've had guys from pokemon showdown come here who are good duelists but only bother for grinding one team. You'd need to breed another team or at least things to switch out to have a chance against our scouters and veterans - yeah, that's an unnecessary entry barrier for our huge 70 person competitive scene.

After playing a few tourneys yesterday it appears the bracket is indeed randomized as it goes - at least, it's not easy in the early rounds to predict who you'll be playing in the later rounds. For example, the "bracket" (really just the tournament interface screen) will show the matchups for round 1, but in round 2 the slots will be filled with ??? v ???, and it's not designed like a bracket so it's not a nice neat flow chart that makes it obvious.

 

However, it does become obvious in certain situations - if 7 of the 8 matches are complete in round 2, for example, and you're the only one sitting in round 3 with a ??? on the other side of your "vs", it's not a very big leap to assume you'll play the winner of the only match still going on in round 2. The same applies for the finals, where it's guarunteed you'll be playing the winner of the other semis match.

 

Even with the randomizer, the dangers of scouting will always be there. As munya said, you are told who you are playing once your 10 minutes start, and 10 minutes is plenty of time to adjust your team based on your opponent. Plus, you can actually watch replays of your opponent's matches while the tournament is going on (or have teammates do it) and accomplish the same thing. The vast majority of successful players have adapted to scouting nowadays, though. It's just a part of the game - training more than a team of 6 is a good idea regardless of scouting, anyways

[Desu]

After playing a few tourneys yesterday it appears the bracket is indeed randomized as it goes - at least, it's not easy in the early rounds to predict who you'll be playing in the later rounds. For example, the "bracket" (really just the tournament interface screen) will show the matchups for round 1, but in round 2 the slots will be filled with ??? v ???, and it's not designed like a bracket so it's not a nice neat flow chart that makes it obvious.

It isn't really randomized, it's just an alternative display to a normal bracket. (Mostly due to GUI/size restraints)

[Gunthug]

It isn't really randomized, it's just an alternative display to a normal bracket. (Mostly due to GUI/size restraints)

Haha I was afraid that might be the case. I didn't follow the transition from round to round closely enough to see if it was a pattern where people fell

[DoubleJ]

Staff run tournies will use the same system but are not part of the unranked or ranked pvp system or monthly tournies. The current staff run events will turn into automated events that have specific set of rules depending on what the host of the Tourney wants.

 

RIP Silph 7 and spectating tournaments. This was one of the best aspects of this game, and now we're just going to have automated crap with no substance. We didn't want to be a battle simulator, but here we are. This system obviously has its benefits, but I stand firmly that this should not replace official tournaments which bring the community together in ways that a blind tournament system never could. 

 

Please lord, keep staff active so that the team tournament at least lives on. 

 

 

EDIT: inb4, but but but replays

Edited March 1, 2016 by DoubleJ

[Kurodashi]

You can spectate in progress battles atleast I was able to do so.

[Munya]

RIP Silph 7 and spectating tournaments. This was one of the best aspects of this game, and now we're just going to have automated crap with no substance. We didn't want to be a battle simulator, but here we are. This system obviously has its benefits, but I stand firmly that this should not replace official tournaments which bring the community together in ways that a blind tournament system never could. 

 

Please lord, keep staff active so that the team tournament at least lives on. 

 

 

EDIT: inb4, but but but replays

 

You can spectate tournaments as they happen.

 

EDIT: beat to it.

[Gunthug]

RIP Silph 7 and spectating tournaments. This was one of the best aspects of this game, and now we're just going to have automated crap with no substance. We didn't want to be a battle simulator, but here we are. This system obviously has its benefits, but I stand firmly that this should not replace official tournaments which bring the community together in ways that a blind tournament system never could.

Please lord, keep staff active so that the team tournament at least lives on.


EDIT: inb4, but but but replays

On the PTS everyone tended to gather upstairs in Verm's PC during tourneys, and you can spectate any tourney match as its happening. Could get pretty crowded up there but the feel will be the same.

Plus, I doubt they'll ever have TT support on this automated tourney thing so silph 7 will still host the best of the best once a month

[DoubleJ]

How does chat work for those spectating then? Can you jump from match-to-match? 

[Gunthug]

How does chat work for those spectating then? Can you jump from match-to-match?

The two battlers have their own normal chat, but I'm not sure if spectators can chime in, too. Since there was only one channel on PTS everyone was talking there, so I guess ch 7 chat could be the new outlet for lions rage?

And yeah spectating is pretty cool, you can exit out and jump into any match on the tournament interface screen

[DoubleJ]

The two battlers have their own normal chat, but I'm not sure if spectators can chime in, too. Since there was only one channel on PTS everyone was talking there, so I guess ch 7 chat could be the new outlet for lions rage?

And yeah spectating is pretty cool, you can exit out and jump into any match on the tournament interface screen

 

As a competitor, can you still join the Channel chat?

[Gunthug]

As a competitor, can you still join the Channel chat?

Yep, The only pitfall I can see is with 8 channels on the main game, people will be queuing from all different channels unless there's an effort on our side to get everyone to 7 (or whatever designated channel)

[DoubleJ]

Aight, my concerns are settled a bit. Still gonna miss seeing the competitors stand across from each other with their teammates beside them cheering them on. I guess I'll just close my eyes and imagine it as I spectate through a computer on a computer in a computer game.  

[Gunthug]

Aight, my concerns are settled a bit. Still gonna miss seeing the competitors stand across from each other with their teammates beside them cheering them on. I guess I'll just close my eyes and imagine it as I spectate through a computer on a computer in a computer game.  

I think the real issue here is how much of a pain in the ass it is to download and run the PTS (especially on my iMac). I say that because I never saw any of you guys on the PTS the last couple days, and it shows - the competitors are literally teleported to a personal battle arena where they stand face to face - you don't get to see the fans, but that part you can use your imagination for haha. The personal arena is pretty cool though, definitely amps up the pressure especially in late round matches

Edited March 1, 2016 by Gunthug

[bl0nde]

How does chat work for those spectating then? Can you jump from match-to-match? 

random thought as I read this: how cool would it be if you could spectate up to two matches at once on your screen for thing like the monthly OU tourney? For example: you could have one long chess type match going on the left side of your monitor and then watch an offensive match on the right side of your monitor. :)  

[aftershocker]

I personally had a fun time in the PTS, although something weird happened in the last tourny I was spectating. The second place prize was a shiny moltres so both players disconnected before the finals match. when they both logged on the were both able to claim the second place prize (since no one technically won?) Maybe it's a bug or something, or maybe that's how the tournies will be if there is no set winner. 

 

[spoiler]  [/spoiler]

[DoubleJ]

I think the real issue here is how much of a pain in the ass it is to download and run the PTS (especially on my iMac). I say that because I never saw any of you guys on the PTS the last couple days, and it shows - the competitors are literally teleported to a personal battle arena where they stand face to face - you don't get to see the fans, but that part you can use your imagination for haha. The personal arena is pretty cool though, definitely amps up the pressure especially in late round matches

 

Yea, that's my own fault honestly. I never check out the PTS because I feel like it steals the hype of the actual update (and who wants to log onto an imaginary platform when the real grind is waiting?).

 

Our typical PTS hunters like Kizhaz have been offline too, so no in-team updates =(

[codylramey]

how big will the auto tourny brackets be?