HP Fire Gengar

[Rendiz]

Just found out my Bulky gengar has HP Fire. Is a bulky HP fire gengar set with WoW /  PS worth using?

[xilias]

bulky gengars are really usefull in this meta,but I dont think hp fire can be usefull

[bl0nde]

• The nature is not mentioned in your opening post.
• You're really cutting down your coverage if you use HP Fire and W-o-W in the same moveset.

[Rendiz]

Nature. Timid, although not the best speed IV (26-27 forgot which) hence why its currently a bulky set.

And I agree somewhat with the coverage issue where HP fire is only really good on sweeper sets but it then has the inherent flaw of not being able to have 31 speed. Was just wondering if anyone could think of some way to make it work outside of catching people off-guard as a pseudo gimmick set.

Edited August 2, 2015 by Rendiz

[bl0nde]

I'd do max special attack EV's then split the remaining EV's between HP and Speed. It looks like you still need a significant speed investment to outspeed jolly heracross and jolly flygon - some of these faster attackers. Metagross is base 70 so that isn't as fast.

 

It's up to you. Figure out what you want your gengar to outrun/take a hit from, then get out the [url=http://pokemonshowdown.com/damagecalc/]calc[/url] to crunch the numbers and make sure you have the set right.

 

The moveset is endlessly debatable, even keeping W-o-W and hp fire is debatable. Sludge bomb and HP fire should stay though. The moveset should depend on what kind of coverage the rest of your team provides. For example, if you have a couple pokemon on the team that you are switching in on bulky waters every time, you probably don't need thunderbolt on gengar too bad. However, If you are investing in bulk, pain split or giga drain can help extend life and that is worth considering too. A type of Choice band set is also worth considering. The extra power will keep you from simply being stopped cold by umbreon or other special walls. 16 PP on sludge bomb for maximum spam of OP'ness.

 

This is my opinion, good luck.

Edited August 2, 2015 by bl0nde

[KaynineXL]

HP Fire is good for Forre. Don't think there is anything else.

[Vaeldras]

HP Fire is good for Forre. Don't think there is anything else.

 

Magneton ayy

[KaynineXL]

Magneton ayy

Bulky gar would lose to mag regardless of HP fire

[Vaeldras]

Also i'll give you my opinions:

 

Hp fire is actually one of the most useful moves gengar can have.

Atm magneton is the only thing that can stop it most of the times, but it loses to hp fire, so take advantage of that.

Keep in mind that you can't have both hp fire and 31 speed, so it's ok.

give it enough speed for jolly flygon and the rest in hp/spatt and shadow ball, no matter what.

Sub punch can stop chansey, tbolt and sludge bomb can fuck up gyarados and ludi.

Just keep hp fire and shadow ball.

[Vaeldras]

Bulky gar would lose to mag regardless of HP fire

 

 

252 SpA Gengar Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Magneton: 152-180 (50 - 59.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

it's a 2hko regardless of what kind of magneton it is.

ofc you need to predict it

 

Edit: so run 252 sp att just to be sure.

again, enough speed for jolly flygon and the rest in hp

 

 

Edit 2: totally forgot it was timid. no sub punch then.

 

I'd go hp fire (252 sp att), sludge bomb, tbolt and shadowball

Edited August 2, 2015 by Vaeldras

[KaynineXL]

252 SpA Gengar Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Magneton: 152-180 (50 - 59.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

it's a 2hko regardless of what kind of magneton it is.

ofc you need to predict it

 

Edit: so run 252 sp att just to be sure.

again, enough speed for jolly flygon and the rest in hp

 

 

Edit 2: totally forgot it was timid. no sub punch then.

 

I'd go hp fire (252 sp att), sludge bomb, tbolt and shadowball

He says bulky gar.

Not Sp atk gar.

 

edit:

I do agree sp atk is probably better.

Also HP Fire is good against Scizor.

Edited August 2, 2015 by KaynineXL

[londark]

Meh, it all boils down to what kind of Magneton you are facing...Personally, i would not run 252/+252 Sp.Def Magneton

 

0 SpA Gengar Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Magneton: 90-106 (57.3 - 67.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

but that's just me, personally, i woud also not run Hp Fire on a Bulky Support/Annoyer Gengar

[Vaeldras]

make it an hp fire sp sweeper k?

[Rendiz]

Only problem with that is then ill need to buy a 4th Gengar to have a bulky Gengar again and not sure how great an idea that is with the impending ban. Also as far as dealing with meta  / scizor goes i feel like WoW set is just kinda better. While HP fire is good vs Magneton im not sure bulky Magnetons are consistent enough atm to warrant almost a whole set devoted to stopping it. I guess it's all about variance (yay looking at usage is fun) and im currently not sure if it's worth it or not.

 

The idea was to see if there was any way of making bulky Gengar work with HP fire so that I would not need to buy another Gengar if I wish to utilize HP fire (although help on HP fire sets is still appreciated). Probably should have elaborated more on the OP.

Edited August 2, 2015 by Rendiz

[BurntZebra]

Nature. Timid, although not the best speed IV (26-27 forgot which) hence why its currently a bulky set.

And I agree somewhat with the coverage issue where HP fire is only really good on sweeper sets but it then has the inherent flaw of not being able to have 31 speed. Was just wondering if anyone could think of some way to make it work outside of catching people off-guard as a pseudo gimmick set.

since hidden power fire can only be even speed, 30 is going to be the highest speed iv you can get and therefore will lose speed ties automatically with other max speed gengars/espeons. 

 

On PTS where I made an hp fire gengar, I ended up going with a bulky offensive gengar that was 3 attacks+pain split. Enough speed for adamant heracross and rest into hp/sp atk. Although not having will o wisp is a bit disappointing, when you have the extra coverage, you don't need will o wisp for chip damage vs forretress/magneton/steelix/scizor

[bigbangattack]

Hell yea rendiz I have another bulky had for you to use between our banks were covered for tournys