UU Tier Discussion Request Thread

[Arimanius]

On 6/18/2017 at 6:43 AM, RysPicz said:

k, then at least let us have this golem discussion thread maybe

We have one tho, dead but we have it xD

 

 

Edited June 20, 2017 by Arimanius

[BlackJovi]

Lol thank you TC. 

[Suneet]

Ayyyyy

[RysPicz]

I'm worried about Haunter's presence. Last time it was already incredibly powerful and unpredictable, pretty sure it was sitting on top of usage as well. Tenta was in the tier back then as well, tanking sludge, outspeeding and killing with surf... I sure will give it a try but I feel like it might deserve a more detailed discussion.

[xXBlu3BreathXx]

I'm wondering if the presence of Haunter is too detrimental to UU. This thing has no true switch in, thus forcing many players to run Choice Scarf Absol and Choice Band Sneasel just to be sure that it won't destroy their whole team, this in turn puts many psychic types in a bad spot due to how often pursuit gets played. The only true counter this thing has might be a specially defensive Nidoqueen with pursuit but even then Will-o-wisp is a pain to deal with and Choice Specs Psychic can 2hko. The Choice Specs set can also 2hko the most prominent special walls being Kangaskan and Cradily.

 

252+ SpA Choice Specs Haunter Psychic vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Nidoqueen: 124-148 (62.9 - 75.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Choice Specs Haunter Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Kangaskhan: 96-114 (45.2 - 53.7%) -- 91.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery and poison damage

252+ SpA Choice Specs Haunter Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Cradily: 81-96 (41.9 - 49.7%) -- 24.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery and poison damage

 

However I do have to admit that Psychic is quite a rare move to be seen on haunter as it provides little coverage alongside its STAB attacks, but do keep in mind getting a Sludge Bomb poison is not that difficult so all specially defensive walls have to watch out for this nuisance. Cradily may have some leeway as it only has a small chance to get killed but it cannot punish Haunter at all.

 

4 Atk Cradily Rock Slide vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Haunter: 67-79 (55.8 - 65.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+1 4 Atk Cradily Rock Slide vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Haunter: 100-118 (83.3 - 98.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

As you can see Cradily has no way to fight back meaning it has already lost the fight. Kangaskhan and Nidoqueen have dark type moves to deal with it (Substitute+Disable could stop them outright if they don't run another attacking move to hit it) but might not even be able to since dark type coverage is a hindrance to their movesets and like I said they could just be 2hko'd outright. Even if we look into possible checks to Haunter like Absol and Sneasel they are only really coming in after something has died, risking a Sludge Bomb could be an automatic loss if it hits them on the switch. Even Scizor that resists Shadow Ball and is immune to Sludge Bomb is put under pressure by Hidden Power Fire.

 

The only reasons why I believe it has somehow stayed in the tier is because 50/50 predictions against normal/steel types and because of how frail it is, however it manages to remedy this in multiple ways such as Substitute, Pain Split and Will-o-wisp. I find that Haunter is too strong for the tier and I personally believe it has some similar characteristics to Gengar before it banned to Ubers.

 

TL;DR Ban Haunter

[NikhilR]

To add to Blue's post, the defensive set with wow / taunt / sludgebomb / painsplit is incredibly annoying as well. 

[LifeStyle]

Yeah Haunter is versatile as shit, you pretty much risk losing 1-2 pokes only through figuring out what kind of set that thing's running.

[MasterVIIP]

Vaporeon OU!!!!

[pachima]

On 05/08/2017 at 10:06 AM, MasterVIIP said:

Vaporeon OU!!!!

yeah man, vaporeon staying UU makes me laugh!

[pachima]

On 31/07/2017 at 6:34 PM, xXBlu3BreathXx said:

I'm wondering if the presence of Haunter is too detrimental to UU. This thing has no true switch in, thus forcing many players to run Choice Scarf Absol and Choice Band Sneasel just to be sure that it won't destroy their whole team, this in turn puts many psychic types in a bad spot due to how often pursuit gets played. The only true counter this thing has might be a specially defensive Nidoqueen with pursuit but even then Will-o-wisp is a pain to deal with and Choice Specs Psychic can 2hko. The Choice Specs set can also 2hko the most prominent special walls being Kangaskan and Cradily.

 

252+ SpA Choice Specs Haunter Psychic vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Nidoqueen: 124-148 (62.9 - 75.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Choice Specs Haunter Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Kangaskhan: 96-114 (45.2 - 53.7%) -- 91.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery and poison damage

252+ SpA Choice Specs Haunter Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Cradily: 81-96 (41.9 - 49.7%) -- 24.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery and poison damage

 

However I do have to admit that Psychic is quite a rare move to be seen on haunter as it provides little coverage alongside its STAB attacks, but do keep in mind getting a Sludge Bomb poison is not that difficult so all specially defensive walls have to watch out for this nuisance. Cradily may have some leeway as it only has a small chance to get killed but it cannot punish Haunter at all.

 

4 Atk Cradily Rock Slide vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Haunter: 67-79 (55.8 - 65.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+1 4 Atk Cradily Rock Slide vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Haunter: 100-118 (83.3 - 98.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

As you can see Cradily has no way to fight back meaning it has already lost the fight. Kangaskhan and Nidoqueen have dark type moves to deal with it (Substitute+Disable could stop them outright if they don't run another attacking move to hit it) but might not even be able to since dark type coverage is a hindrance to their movesets and like I said they could just be 2hko'd outright. Even if we look into possible checks to Haunter like Absol and Sneasel they are only really coming in after something has died, risking a Sludge Bomb could be an automatic loss if it hits them on the switch. Even Scizor that resists Shadow Ball and is immune to Sludge Bomb is put under pressure by Hidden Power Fire.

 

The only reasons why I believe it has somehow stayed in the tier is because 50/50 predictions against normal/steel types and because of how frail it is, however it manages to remedy this in multiple ways such as Substitute, Pain Split and Will-o-wisp. I find that Haunter is too strong for the tier and I personally believe it has some similar characteristics to Gengar before it banned to Ubers.

 

TL;DR Ban Haunter

if any haunter locks itself into sbomb, its asking to be pursuited by scizor badly.

EDIT: Tbh, life orb set or the defensive one @NikhilR posted, are far more wide and annoying to deal than specs set.

On the other hand, those 2 sets are slightly easier to check into.

Edited August 8, 2017 by pachima

[DarylDixon]

what is steelix and pikachu usage in uu?

[Toast]

5 minutes ago, DarylDixon said:

what is steelix and pikachu usage in uu?

i think pikachu is banned from NU so its like BL2

[DarylDixon]

7 minutes ago, Toast said:

i think pikachu is banned from NU so its like BL2

if i remember pikachu got banned because was to op or for the usage?

[Toast]

8 minutes ago, DarylDixon said:

if i remember pikachu got banned because was to op or for the usage?

too op iirc

[DarylDixon]

16 hours ago, Toast said:

too op iirc

so TC autism 2 op... if pikachu got banned cuz to op why granbull is still nu ? i see alot of match UU and i dont see pikachu or steelix so if granbull can uu - nu 700 times, why not back pikachu in NU and steelix come NU?

 

srry my english ( my english work better than your shit job how tier council.) (im not meaning u toast but the all the TC)

Edited August 28, 2017 by DarylDixon

[DaftCoolio]

33 minutes ago, DarylDixon said:

so TC autism 2 op... if pikachu got banned cuz to op why granbull is still nu ? i see alot of match UU and i dont see pikachu or steelix so if granbull can uu - nu 700 times, why not back pikachu in NU and steelix come NU?

 

srry my english ( my english work better than your shit job how tier council.) (im not meaning u toast but the all the TC)

There is a Granbull discussion thread open at the moment, feel free to post in it. As for Steelix and Pikachu they were both UU by usage in August, this is why they aren't in NU.

[KaynineXL]

3 minutes ago, DaftCoolio said:

There is a Granbull discussion thread open at the moment, feel free to post in it. As for Steelix and Pikachu they were both UU by usage in August, this is why they aren't in NU.

and why is gyarados in OU coolio?

[BlackJovi]

Man tc ever how shit job...

[KaynineXL]

u see how cant even give a reason for gyarados in OU, what a noob

[DaftCoolio]

22 minutes ago, KaynineXL said:

and why is gyarados in OU coolio?

because its a dragon type and dragon types are strong

[DarylDixon]

53 minutes ago, DaftCoolio said:

There is a Granbull discussion thread open at the moment, feel free to post in it. As for Steelix and Pikachu they were both UU by usage in August, this is why they aren't in NU.

i know but  now i don't see alot of pikachu's or steelix in uu.. why they doesnt back nu? what is the usage of pikachu and steelix?

[DaftCoolio]

3 minutes ago, DarylDixon said:

i know but  now i don't see alot of pikachu's or steelix in uu.. why they doesnt back nu? what is the usage of pikachu and steelix?

 

[DiDi]

Ban shuckle cancer ban kecleon ability cancer big cancer can't break these walls need pikachu unban please is not op I swear is shit like tc 

[LifeStyle]

lmao this is gold

[BlackJovi]

Just now, LifeStyle said:

lmao this is gold

Im not meaning u but the all the tc