YettoDie Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 Just now, BlackJovi said: pursuit absol eaz pursuit hound.... ooh wait. DaftCoolio 1 Link to comment
BlackJovi Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 Just now, YettoDie said: pursuit hound.... ooh wait. unfair ban Liberalisme, SirYurop and DoubleJ 3 Link to comment
BurntZebra Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 22 minutes ago, RysPicz said: Run Hypno. And you got all Sceptile sets covered. And even a sun exegg. Well that requires you to run max hp/sp def which isn't ideal for taking on other threats. And if you run hypno, then that's bait for crawdaunt, scizor, zangoose, sneasel, calm minders, kangaskhan, steelix, etc. Link to comment
DaftCoolio Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 Scept can get leech as well which can stall the bulkier non grass counter like kanga and miltank Link to comment
fredrichnietze Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 sub + leech stall with sleep and or taunt can be scary. Link to comment
RysPicz Posted August 15, 2016 Share Posted August 15, 2016 14 hours ago, fredrichnietze said: sub + leech stall with sleep and or taunt can be scary. Sceptile can't taunt, nor sleep (unless grasswhistle, which is 55% accuracy and noone maybe except gbwead would run it) gbwead and fredrichnietze 2 Link to comment
BlackJovi Posted August 15, 2016 Share Posted August 15, 2016 yeah let's not forget sceptile only gets 4 moves. DoubleJ 1 Link to comment
Spaintakula Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 14 hours ago, RysPicz said: Sceptile can't taunt, nor sleep (unless grasswhistle, which is 55% accuracy and noone maybe except gbwead would run it) I'd run it, and don't forget grasswhistle hits grass types too, so sleep for everyone DoubleJ 1 Link to comment
Kizhaz Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 49 minutes ago, Spaintakula said: I'd run it, and don't forget grasswhistle hits grass types too, so sleep for everyone Soundproof Electrode best counter 2016 Spaintakula and DoubleJ 2 Link to comment
fredrichnietze Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 8 minutes ago, Kizhaz said: Soundproof Electrode best counter 2016 but dont forget it's running eq too to counter soundproof trode ofc. Link to comment
Jolyne Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 How's Cloyster doing? Link to comment
OrangeManiac Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 30 minutes ago, Jolyne said: How's Cloyster doing? Kinda mediocre. The tier has sort of shortage of Spikers so therefor it will gain usage only because of that reason but as a Pokemon it's nothing amazing. It's fairly easily dealt with both special sweepers as well as notably many physical ones. Walls like Plume, Slowking also cause much trouble to Cloyster.. There's just so many bad matchups for it in so many cases. Link to comment
pachima Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 On 14/08/2016 at 3:53 PM, gbwead said: Venomoth Calm is godly. Ledian Careful Early Bird Rest is the ultimate Sceptile gimmick counter xD Rock slide easy. On 14/08/2016 at 4:49 PM, BlackJovi said: pursuit absol eaz Focus Punch Hypno on switch even more easy. Link to comment
OrangeManiac Posted September 30, 2016 Share Posted September 30, 2016 I'm inclined to say that I think Sceptile needs a discussion. The mixed set has amazing sweeping potential and with Hidden Power there is no reliable counters to it. You also take wayyyy too much damage mid game trying to scout its moveset. I feel like Sceptile meets Offensive Uber Characteristics in current UU and therefor needs a discussion thread whether others agree about it. gbwead, Leorodo, SirYurop and 3 others 6 Link to comment
OrangeManiac Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 So what's up with quickbanning and test banning UUs without any discussion thread or any community input or.... You know, I dont even care anymore if it's gonna be like this so no point to start even ranting. Mike, xilias, Leorodo and 13 others 16 Link to comment
BlackJovi Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 > bringing down a monster like typloshion without talking about it or anything Rendiz, xXBlu3BreathXx, LifeStyle and 6 others 9 Link to comment
Parke Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 literally, lets remove one ridiculously OP mon and add another for the lols Suneet, RysPicz, xXBlu3BreathXx and 1 other 4 Link to comment
Mike Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Gotta love how they make no discussion thread for banning sceptile when its been in the tier for ages. Gotta love how they take sceptile to OU while they leave the cancer called Zangoose. Gotta love the fact that they bring a really strong specs user with a base 150 power stab move to it. 100 speed is more than enough to run specs in UU. Oh and using altaria as an argument really isnt valid. Because you know, hp ice. xXBlu3BreathXx, Rendiz, Suneet and 3 others 6 Link to comment
Laz Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 ^ if TC would just straightly ban Kanga for a month, drop the beast / Future broken Typhlosion to UU, then what's the purpose of discussion threads ? On another funny note, why aren't TC members voted by TC instead of secretly chosen ? I do understand that someone who never plays pvp can still have some respectable knowledge, but not even contributing to the discussion thread like never + never playing pvp, that combo is not convincing at all, just my 50cent ft the game_this isn't how we do. BlackJovi, Rendiz, Osuki and 8 others 11 Link to comment
fredrichnietze Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 20 minutes ago, Lazaro23 said: why aren't TC members voted by TC instead of secretly chosen i pushed for this a long time ago and upper staff said no. they want someone who will do the job and do the job well, but also will respect staff, not share secrets like "hey this is being implemented soon(tm) lets talk about how it effects the meta game", and other various traits. the job is also being a small part of representing pokemmo and agreeing to all those "do not disclose" and other agreements. community voted tier council will happen about the same time we get community voted staff members for the same reasons. however last i heard their were openings, apply by pm'ing tyrone and make some good arguments, and maybe link to some of your best.try to keep back on the troll post, dont make personal attacks or bad logic, and use good arguments not on this list https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/, format your arguments in a manner that make apparent the point and the reasoning with proof and is simple to understand. the empty spots exist because this is a hard job with little to no thanks and lots of time and energy behind the scenes and at the end of the day their's still more to do and people hate you. Suneet, Tyrone and Gunthug 3 Link to comment
Laz Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 (edited) Typhlosion Note: With a usage of just over 4%, Typhlosion has dropped down to UU and will be allowed in the tier. The meta seems to have plenty of checks to Typhlosion in the form of Slowking, Miltank, Altaria and others, such that the Tier Council believes it would probably not be Uber Offensive. 252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Slowking: 86-102 (42.5 - 50.4%) -- 41.8% chance to 2HKO after 1 layer of Spikes and Leftovers recovery 252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Altaria: 164-196 (90.1 - 107.6%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO 252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Altaria: 89-105 (48.9 - 57.6%) -- 57.8% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery 252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Cradily: 128-152 (66.3 - 78.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery 252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Thick Fat Miltank: 84-100 (41.5 - 49.5%) -- 26.2% chance to 2HKO after 1 layer of Spikes and Leftovers recovery ROFL, what are you talking about mateeeeeeee Edited October 3, 2016 by Lazaro23 RysPicz, DoubleJ, BlackJovi and 3 others 6 Link to comment
Gunthug Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 We don't do discussion threads for drop down tests - we seemed that it was worthy of a test, so the discussion begins now as to whether it belongs or not. For sceptile, I guess we could have done a discussion but it was unanimously voted to fit offensive uber (though I think it's more of a gengar like ban where it fit a lot of ban criteria at least a little bit). A discussion thread would have only slowed things down, something we've gotten a lot of pushback on lately Kanga was another unanimous decision, but I do think a discussion thread should go up now to chart how UU looks without the beast. Just because we've agreed on a test ban for unhealthiness doesn't mean it's for sure staying banned, UU has been dominated by kanga for so long that I think we're all very curious to see what happens without it gbwead and xXBlu3BreathXx 2 Link to comment
xXBlu3BreathXx Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Lmfao I can't believe Typhlosion is being moved down with such haste. There are only few switches ins for this monster, most of them altering their ev spreads/movesets just to deal with it. To top it off you test Kanga just as you bring in a new mon to the tier, if the kanga ban is not successful what does it say when we can't even compare it in a meta with typhl? Anyways onto the calcs 252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mantine: 48-57 (27.9 - 33.1%) -- 94.8% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery 252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Hidden Power Electric vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Mantine: 124-148 (72 - 86%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery 252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Hypno: 111-132 (57.8 - 68.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery Could work with a double protect? 252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Hidden Power Grass vs. 252 HP / 0+ SpD Slowking: 90-106 (44.5 - 52.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery Running a calm nature equates to 100 Evs in Spdef which means Slowking would be specifically built to beat Typhl and losing the needed bulk for mons like scizor and hitmonlee. 0 Atk Typhlosion Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Tentacruel: 92-110 (49.1 - 58.8%) -- 98% chance to 2HKO 252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Extrasensory vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Tentacruel: 104-124 (55.6 - 66.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery 0 Atk Typhlosion Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Flareon: 98-116 (56.9 - 67.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery 252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Thick Fat Grumpig: 58-69 (31 - 36.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO after Leftovers recovery Needs rest but what if piggy is already asleep? 252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Thick Fat Miltank: 76-91 (37.6 - 45%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery One of the few I would consider worth running as a dedicated counter. 252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Quagsire: 118-139 (58.4 - 68.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery Soooo kek 252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Altaria: 152-180 (83.5 - 98.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery Just chip it with one eruption and you are good to go with the predict. 252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Lanturn: 80-94 (34.4 - 40.5%) -- 52.3% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery 252 SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Hidden Power Grass vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Lanturn: 100-118 (43.1 - 50.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery Funniest thing is I know for a fact people would not fear running modest specs to bypass some of these checks/counters... 252+ SpA Choice Specs Typhlosion Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Altaria: 164-196 (90.1 - 107.6%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO Please don't let this thing see the light of day in UU, all it would do is encorage wall cores that can take on eruption + hp elec/grass/ice coverage or we could be forced to use something like miltank or grumpig just to get by. Wasn't a reason why many people found sceptile strong was because of the lack of knowledge of the hidden power? So I believe that Typhl shares similar characteristics to Sceptile, if it really wanted to you could run a mixed set with orb eq low kick/focusp flames hp grass/elec/ice. Sure this thing has answers but they are the most niches answers to use, why else would you run a miltank? You could try your luck on a curse sweep or a cleric but not much else. Typhl would just be too centralising by forcing you to run specific counters. BlackJovi, RysPicz, Gunthug and 8 others 11 Link to comment
pachima Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Now I see why is ninetales UU. They want players to give it usage. Gunthug and aftershocker 2 Link to comment
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