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DoubleJ

Double Battles Viability Thread

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I haven't played this game for months now, so could be wrong, but I've seen golduck work efficiently in doubbles as weather is more common than in singles, so I think it disserves a place there, mainly because of it's ability?

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Anyone know the mechanics behind two lightning rod pokes being on the field?

lrod pokes dont draw their own attacks so if both lrod pokes are on the same side of the feild and one of them uses a electric attack the other one will draw it. if they are on opposite sides of the field and one of them uses it the other will draw. if a non lrod poke uses a electric attack im pretty sure the Lrod user on the opposite side of the field takes priority but im not positive. 

hopes this helps.

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lrod pokes dont draw their own attacks so if both lrod pokes are on the same side of the feild and one of them uses a electric attack the other one will draw it. if they are on opposite sides of the field and one of them uses it the other will draw. if a non lrod poke uses a electric attack im pretty sure the Lrod user on the opposite side of the field takes priority but im not positive. 

hopes this helps.

 

Nah I meant, if you have two Lightning Rod users on the field and your opponent uses an electric-type attack, who absorbs it?

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Nah I meant, if you have two Lightning Rod users on the field and your opponent uses an electric-type attack, who absorbs it?

 

The faster one.

 

 

I haven't played this game for months now, so could be wrong, but I've seen golduck work efficiently in doubbles as weather is more common than in singles, so I think it disserves a place there, mainly because of it's ability?

 

Nah. Weather is not that common and if you want to stop it, Golduck is definitely not the way. Ttar ftw.

 

 

As for Arcanine, I am convinced it deserves a better ranking. than C, without a doubt. The ability to intimidate makes bulky Arcanine a true force, as it can take rock slides from an intimidated Aerodactyl pretty well (42.6% - 51.8%). It can Extremespeed, Morning Sun, has a powerful Flamethrower, and Crunch for ghosts, while it can Toxic-Stall slower pokemon. Rank A imo.

Edited by OldKeith

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The faster one.



Nah. Weather is not that common and if you want to stop it, Golduck is definitely not the way. Ttar ftw.


As for Arcanine, I am convinced it deserves a better ranking. than C, without a doubt. The ability to intimidate makes bulky Arcanine a true force, as it can take rock slides from an intimidated Aerodactyl pretty well (42.6% - 51.8%). It can Extremespeed, Morning Sun, has a powerful Flamethrower, and Crunch for ghosts, while it can Toxic-Stall slower pokemon. Rank A imo.


But it doesn't hit aero back =( I really don't think it had much of a place in Doubles. Fire typing has been consistently bad in doubles and with its poor speed as a bulky dog it only really serves to Intimidate. Toxic stall isn't all that favored as a playstyle in doubles right now either. Weak to common ground, rock, and water attacks and without much of an offensive presence, I really can't see it any higher than B at best.

Looking for usage. Looking for players to use the dog and prove me wrong.

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But it doesn't hit aero back =( I really don't think it had much of a place in Doubles. Fire typing has been consistently bad in doubles and with its poor speed as a bulky dog it only really serves to Intimidate. Toxic stall isn't all that favored as a playstyle in doubles right now either. Weak to common ground, rock, and water attacks and without much of an offensive presence, I really can't see it any higher than B at best.

Seems like you underestimate the power of intimidate. While no, it may not hit some doubles threats that hard and it lacks WoW and Snarl (which make it today viable in VGC), it hits common threats seen in our Doubles meta: 2hko Gengar, 2hko any of the ever present Metagross, deal with Heracross and it is bulky enough to take on physical hits. Ground moves are rather easy to bypass using your other team members, and Arcanine can sit nicely through rock moves, while the teammate deals the damage. As for the water moves, you probably refer to Waterfall, which pretty much comes from Gyarados and Kingdra, and that's it. Surf is not really reliable or seen a lot. In doubles, a pokemon does not really need to sweep in order to be viable, intimidate from Arcanine and the lack of a 4x weakness unlike other intimidaters put it in the list of the best doubles walls imo. It's annoying and a good phazer as it can just drop by an intimidate, heal and come back later. +2 priority is again very useful and often makes a difference.

 

 

Looking for usage. Looking for players to use the dog and prove me wrong.

 

Glad you asked. http://challonge.com/HdubsT

 

 

Rand A: Reserved for Pokemon that are fantastic in the Doubles metagame, and can sweep, support, or wall significant portions of the metagame. 

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Seems like you underestimate the power of intimidate. While no, it may not hit some doubles threats that hard and it lacks WoW and Snarl (which make it today viable in VGC), it hits common threats seen in our Doubles meta: 2hko Gengar, 2hko any of the ever present Metagross, deal with Heracross and it is bulky enough to take on physical hits. Ground moves are rather easy to bypass using your other team members, and Arcanine can sit nicely through rock moves, while the teammate deals the damage. As for the water moves, you probably refer to Waterfall, which pretty much comes from Gyarados and Kingdra, and that's it. Surf is not really reliable or seen a lot. In doubles, a pokemon does not really need to sweep in order to be viable, intimidate from Arcanine and the lack of a 4x weakness unlike other intimidaters put it in the list of the best doubles walls imo. It's annoying and a good phazer as it can just drop by an intimidate, heal and come back later. +2 priority is again very useful and often makes a difference.

 

 

 

Glad you asked. http://challonge.com/HdubsT

 

 

Rand A: Reserved for Pokemon that are fantastic in the Doubles metagame, and can sweep, support, or wall significant portions of the metagame. 

 

I understand the power of Intimidate. It's been a staple in doubles since it was implemented here in PokeMMO, and even before that in other competitive Pokemon games. 

 

Arcanine has difficulty stopping nearly anything in an offensive format. Flamethrower is a powerful attack, especially against a Clear Body CB Metagross. Its bulk lets it survive most physical attacks, even super effective EQ due to the split damage. Unfortunately there are a wide range of pokemon that handle it quite well. Snorlax giggles at Arcanine and turns it into Curse bait, which is fairly terrifying in Doubles. Arcanine also has insane difficulty with Rain teams, meaning its primary STAB is significantly weaker and it can't readily switch in. It's also bait for Gyarados Dragon Dance, although Toxic helps here greatly.

 

Considering your arguments above, I will move it to B-rank due to its support ability. It can Intimidate and Extremespeed away most low health threats. It's typing and lower speed though inhibit qualities that are necessary for A-rank, in my opinion. 

 

With further support, and additional use in Doubles, I would be willing to move it up further, but with only one player supportive of this poke I can't see it going any higher than B right now. 

 

Thanks for your input Keith brah, I look forward to future Doubles tourneys with you. 

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i was the 9%

 

im also that one gy who didnt use meta round 1

i think firelion didn't run kanga vs me either, although I think he was running your team basically 

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Update: After reviewing the Usage Statistics, I made the following changes

 

Metagross to S-Rank: The most popular pokemon with amazing coverage, a splendid movepool, and a powerful ability. It's weak to rare Fire-type attacks and to Ground attacks, unfortunately most Ground attacks come in the form of EQ which has split damage. Metagross is a force to be reckoned with and that is evident in its high usage.

 

Hitmontop to A-Rank: Its high usage, wonderful defenses, and perfect ability warranted a bump up on this list. Hitmontop can absorb common Rock Slides and strike back with priority or a vast movepool. A wonderful addition to most teams. 

 

Ursaring to C-Rank: Saw some usage and with its powerful attack, GUTS ability, and coverage should warrant at least a C-Rank.

 

Breloom to C-Rank: With the ability to abuse Sleep and attack with STAB Priority, Breloom has an opportunity to shine. Unfortunately still quite frail. 

 

Jynx to C-Rank: A smogon commodity that pairs quite well with Smeargle's versatility. She saw some usage and is represented accordingly.

 

Kangaskhan to A+-Rank:  Still one of the most highly used pokemon, but it saw its usage drop quite a bit during this tournament. The fastest viable Fake-Out right now still gives it a nod for A+. 

 

 

EDIT: I plan on wiping everything not present in the Doubles usage stats and only adding them if they appear in future events. It seems only fair to base the criteria for this Viability list on things that have seen actual use in PokeMMO, not simply by theory. 

Edited by DoubleJ

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EDIT: I plan on wiping everything not present in the Doubles usage stats and only adding them if they appear in future events. It seems only fair to base the criteria for this Viability list on things that have seen actual use in PokeMMO, not simply by theory. 

maybe you should wait until we have more usage stats? one tournament can accurately represent a entire meta game.

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maybe you should wait until we have more usage stats? one tournament can accurately represent a entire meta game.

 

My thoughts behind that would be just to see actual true viability in PokeMMO as it evolved with each tournament. 

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Saw Gilvy run a Claydol
Claydol should fit in here at C in my opinion since it can icebeam, psychic, Eq, explode and set up dual screens. It also has high defenses while resisting rock slides and immune to earthquake. It's other weaknesses hurt though and its offensive presence is..meh

Also I'd like to see Clefable moved from C to B. It has awesome support. Boltbeam and other moves giving it viable attacks. It also has follow me, helping hand, instant health, wish, cleric, dual screens, encore, etc. I think it has great support, deserving of a higher rank, although Blissey outclasses it in some areas.

Edited by DrCraig

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Saw Gilvy run a Claydol
Claydol should fit in here at C in my opinion since it can icebeam, psychic, Eq, explode and set up dual screens. It also has high defenses while resisting rock slides and immune to earthquake. It's other weaknesses hurt though and its offensive presence is..meh

Also I'd like to see Clefable moved from C to B. It has awesome support. Boltbeam and other moves giving it viable attacks. It also has follow me, helping hand, instant health, wish, cleric, dual screens, encore, etc. I think it has great support, deserving of a higher rank, although Blissey outclasses it in some areas.


Agreed on both. Clefable is great because you don't know what set it is until your already behind if played correctly.

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I'll add claydol later and will think about clefable a bit throughout the day. More comments on the matter always help.

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maybe im wrong but I havnt seen a heracross used in a while I think tht it is great in ou but in doubles it takes too many hits to be effective especially if the opposing team members both go after it.

also lack of priority and overall speed do not do it ay favors. and neither of its abilities help it to take duel intimidates either. for the best results u need CB or to set up. set up requires time that Hera tends not to have while CB limits what it can do

I would conider it B/B- really at best

Ide like to hear thoughts on this

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