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Double Battles Viability Thread

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Welcome to the Doubles Viability Thread. If you do not know what a viability thread entails read further. A viability thread has a purpose to put Pokémon into 'ranks', by lack of a better term. In the Double Battles viability rankings we base our rankings on how viable certain Pokémon in Doubles are. Discussion is encouraged and remember that you are always entitled to your opinion but don't forget to be respectful to other community members.

 

There won't be a split between offensive/defensive/support Pokémon as this is a general viability thread. Meaning offensive and defensive Pokémon can fit into the same rank without utilizing the same role.

 

Lastly, this thread also functions as a discussion about the Doubles metagame. So by all means do not hold back on discussing your thoughts. Bringing underrated Pokémon up for discussion is also part of a viability thread discussion. When proposing a ranking change please post reasoning behind your argument to make sure we avoid the thread being littered.

 

***Unfortunately, the staff of PokeMMO no longer collect usage statistics for doubles battles and the statistics here are past date by over a year. Regardless, we continue to maintain this thread by discussing the viability of pokemon throughout the doubles meta and rank them by theory and practice. Thank you to everyone involved. 

 

Current Hot Topics

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Resources for Discussion

Usage Statistics References

 

Guide to Doubles Play in PokeMMO

 

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PokeMMO Double Battles Viability Ranking

(In order by usage)

Note: I placed each pokemon in ranking according to my opinion to start discussion. So please, discuss moving them.

 

S RankReserved for Pokemon that are the pinnacle of the Doubles metagame. These Pokemon are able to perform a variety of roles very effectively, or can just do one extremely well. Their use has low risk involved and high reward exerted. Pokemon in this rank have very few flaws that are patched up by numerous positive traits. These Pokemon define the metagame.

 

S Rank:

metagross.png  Metagross (70.1%)

gengar.png  Gengar (53.6%)

blastoise.png  Blastoise (2.3%)

milotic.png  Milotic (???)

 

 

A RankReserved for Pokemon that are fantastic in the Doubles metagame, and can sweep, support, or wall significant portions of the metagame. These Pokemon require less support than most others to be used effectively and have few flaws that can easily be compensated for when compared to their positive traits. These Pokemon exert a strong presence in the metagame.

 

A+ Rank:

salamence.png  Salamence (34.0%)

gyarados.png  Gyarados (33.2%)

blissey.png  Blissey (21.4%)

hitmontop.png  Hitmontop (20.6%)

tyranitar.png  Tyranitar (9.3%)

 

A Rank:

Starmie (22.3%)

Dragonite (19.6%)

Venusaur (14.8%)

Vaporeon (12.6%)

Manectric (9.9%)

Blaziken (0.6%)

 

 

B RankReserved for Pokemon that are great in the Doubles metagame. These Pokemon have more notable flaws than those above them that affect how they function in the tier. Their positive traits still outshine their negatives, but they require a bit more team support to bring out their full potential. These Pokemon exert an above average presence in the metagame.

 

B+ Rank:

Aerodactyl (38.1%)

Jolteon (27.2%)

Snorlax (25.2%)

Ludicolo (23.7%)

Swampert (15.9%)

Heracross (10.1%)

Kingdra (9.7%)

Clefable (6.0%)

Arcanine (5.4%)

Tentacruel (0.4%)

Typhlosion (???)

 

B  Rank:

Kangaskhan (19.6%)

Marowak (12.6%)

Slowbro (9.3%)

Gardevoir (3.5%)

Porygon2 (3.3%)

Tauros (3.3%)

Charizard (2.5%)

Hariyama (2.1%)

Alakazam (1.9%)

Raichu (0.6%)

Skarmory (0.6%)

 

 

C RankReserved for Pokemon that are mediocre in the Doubles metagame, but have just as many notable flaws that prevent them from being effective. Pokemon in the C tier often require significant support to be effective. Pokemon from this rank tend to face a lot of competition with the more commonly used Pokemon. These Pokemon exert a below average presence in the metagame.

 

C Rank:

Dusclops (10.3%)

Flygon (3.7%)

Rhydon (2.9%)

Dugtrio (2.7%)

Weezing (2.3%)

Forretress (1.6%)

Quagsire (1.6%)

Ursaring (1.6%)

Lapras (1.4%)

Umbreon (1.4%)

Ninjask (0.6%)

Crobat (0.4%)

Machamp (0.4%)

Lanturn (0.2%)

Scizor (0.2%)

Smeargle (???)

 

 

D RankReserved for Pokemon that are highly mediocre in the Doubles metagame, but are viable enough to justify their use on select teams. These Pokemon are only capable of doing their specific task and fail at doing anything more than that. Pokemon from this rank have multiple crippling flaws that prevent them from being successful a majority of the time, and are often severely outclassed because of it. These Pokemon exert a poor presence in the metagame.

 

D Rank:

Breloom (2.1%)

Espeon (1.0%)

Hypno (0.8%)

Kingler (0.8%)

Vileplume (0.8%)

Girafarig (0.6%)

Jynx (0.6%)

Lunatone (0.6%)

Noctowl (0.6%)

Donphan (0.4%)

Cloyster (0.4%)

Mr. Mime (0.4%)

Sableye (0.4%)

Altaria (0.2%)

Metang (0.2%)

Ninetales (0.2%)

Persian (0.2%)

Politoed (0.2%)

Relicanth (0.2%)

Roselia (0.2%)

Slowking (0.2%)

Swalot (0.2%)

Wailord (0.2%)

Whiscash (0.2%)

 

 

 

Note: Please point out any errors. All pokemon listed are from the Doubles Usage Statistics. Usage percentage is listed alongside the named pokemon.

 

Usage has not been updated since January 26, 2016, use this guide with caution. 

Credits to DrCraig for the amazing banner. 

 

[Definitions of each rank established from the OU Viability Thread of PokeMMO]

 

Edited by DoubleJ
To exert my dominance of course.

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i think hitmontop deserves a bit of love in doubles metagame.

 

Intimidate is awesome, access to earthquake and rock slide makes it able to hit combined with his pair immunities, also could carry mach punch or fake out.

 

since Doubles isn't my thing, I'm not sure about the position but I believe Hitmontop could be a B or C rank

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i think hitmontop deserves a bit of love in doubles metagame.

 

Intimidate is awesome, access to earthquake and rock slide makes it able to hit combined with his pair immunities, also could carry mach punch or fake out.

 

since Doubles isn't my thing, I'm not sure about the position but I believe Hitmontop could be a B or C rank

 

Ah totally right, I spaced it when looking through the UU Usage Stats (probs not that high or not even present). 

 

Please recommend any other lower tier pokes that may be effective. 

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Definitely not a doubles player but I need to say Clefable with Follow Me is quite amazing the couple of times I played against it. With the nice bulk of Clefable, its partner can quite easily set up and do some massive damage. Would rank at B even.

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Definitely not a doubles player but I need to say Clefable with Follow Me is quite amazing the couple of times I played against it. With the nice bulk of Clefable, its partner can quite easily set up and do some massive damage. Would rank at B even.

 

Ah good catch, added Clef and Blastoise to B and C Rank respectively. 

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metagross s
sala a+
gyara a+/s
dnite a/b
kingdra a
bliss a
jolteon a
dusclops b+
top b+
arcanine b/b+

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id consider rhydon for B rnak it gets enough speed to outpace certain threats and can limit potential rampages of sala and lax

this paired up with lightning rod makes for a great partner for pokes with electric weakness.

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metagross s Tough choice, it's insane and could easily get bumped up. Get a bit more support from the community and it will go right up.
 
sala a+ Sala is still an overpowering option in this meta. It's speed, access to intimidate, and ability to sweep in multiple ways makes it an easy S-rank imo
 
gyara a+/s A devastating force, but outclassed by Salamence. I could consider this for A+ though
 
dnite a/b Definite A at the very least
 
kingdra a Ability to run Mixed vs Physical vs Special with Rain support. It's a powerhouse that is easily an A in my opinion.
 
bliss a Outclasses by Snorlax
 
jolteon a Outclassed by Manectric in my opinion considering Manectric's access to lightning rod and broader movepool
 
dusclops b+ Serves one real purpose and that's to provide WoW. Is hit by a plethora of common attacks and doesn't do much to hit back. B imo.
 
top b+ Tough spot. It's like a mini-Kangaskhan with Intimidate. Will consider moving it up.
 
arcanine b/b+ I'm not seeing this at all. What use does it have other than to spread Intimidate? I don't think I've even seen one in any recent doubles battles. 
 

id consider rhydon for B rnak it gets enough speed to outpace certain threats and can limit potential rampages of sala and lax

this paired up with lightning rod makes for a great partner for pokes with electric weakness.

 

Lightning rod is great, but I see it being outclassed by Marowak as a kinda fast physical sweeper in this roll. 

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I think gyara deserves S rank
Because of intimidate and easy access to sweeping after 1 or 2 DDs and with move like EQ it can take out both opposing pokes in one hit

Also I think ttar should be moved down to C or C+
Because it has DD and superpower it does pretty good but can easily countered by pokes with intimidate or a high defense stat. Also has many weaknesses such as bug, grass, water and especially fighting.

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the rock is a blessing and a curse here in that the rock lets it live off attacks that would normally kill wak cause lack of resistances

 

This is true, but in my opinion Marowak might be the safer option still. I'd like to hear some further input defining which of these should be where.

 

Marowak - Weak to Ice, Water, and Grass. Resistant to Poison and Rock. Immune to Electric.

 

Rhydon - Weak to 4x Water, 4x Grass, Ice, Fighting, Ground, and Steel. Resistant to Poison, Rock, Normal, Flying, and Fire. Immune to Electric.

 

Marowak is slightly faster and has similar power with Rock Slide compared to Rhydon (STAB vs Thick Club). Both have access to STAB Ground. Rhydon can use Megahorn.

 

It's real close imo. 

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-gyara a+/s A devastating force, but outclassed by Salamence. I could consider this for A+ though 

 

I wouldn't say outclassed by sala bc they work in different way, sala has more weakness, which make gyara a better inti user, yea sala hits strong, but  gyara can be paired with lighting rod users which make it almost unstoppable. (edited).

 

 

- bliss a Outclasses by Snorlax

 

bliss is better, immune to inti, will, insta recovery, also lax lost hypervoice.

 

 

-arcanine b/b+ I'm not seeing this at all. What use does it have other than to spread Intimidate? I don't think I've even seen one in any recent doubles battles. 

 

Not a thing that u consider on ur team, but great after scouting to check hera, cb meta and stuff.

Edited by Frag

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-gyara a+/s A devastating force, but outclassed by Salamence. I could consider this for A+ though 

 

I wouldn't say outclassed by sala bc they work in different way, sala has more weakness, which make gyara a better inti user, yea sala hits strong, but  gyara can be paired with lighting rod users which make it almost unstoppable. (edited).

 

 

- bliss a Outclasses by Snorlax

 

bliss is better, immune to inti, will, insta recovery, also lax lost hypervoice.

 

 

-arcanine b/b+ I'm not seeing this at all. What use does it have other than to spread Intimidate? I don't think I've even seen one in any recent doubles battles. 

 

Not a thing that u consider on ur team, but great after scouting to check hera, cb meta and stuff.

 

I like your argument for Gyarados. Lightning Rod support does somewhat negate that common 4x Electric weakness. Salamence does have to avoid common Dragon spam and thus has a tougher time setting up and coming in. I like the input and I think I'm going to make the switch.

 

Salamence to A+

Gyarados to S

 

Snorlax still has the ability to use STAB Self-Destruct as well as a plethora of other attacks. It has higher Defense than Blissey and can Curse as well. While it isn't as great of a Special Wall as the powerful Blissey, it has a broader range of use that Blissey can't even begin to understand. Goign to leave this one for now. 

 

Arcanine does provide a decent scout, but it's usage is too low in my opinion (from what I've seen), and it provides very little in the way of offense. C-rank imo. 

 

 

EDIT: Also Dragonite down to A-Rank

Edited by DoubleJ

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IMHO Blastoise needs to be a B.

 

It supports dragon setup way too well with follow me AND icy wind, it literally removes the shit salamence is weak too and/or makes it single target blast instead. That alone makes it viable as fuark

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So I guess the argument comes down to, who is the better Follow-Me user, Clefable or Blastoise.

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So I guess the argument comes down to, who is the better Follow-Me user, Clefable or Blastoise.

Well Clefable does get helping hand, softboil, twave, cosmic power and screens also. Can ice beam like toise but no speed drops.

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So I guess the argument comes down to, who is the better Follow-Me user, Clefable or Blastoise.

Clefable takes heavy damage from most things not named shadow ball, blastoise takes nasty damage from grass and electric attacks but absorbs ice beams, burns, dragon attacks, body slams etc.

And correct me if I'm wrong blastoise has better bulk and a better move pool to Clefable

Muddy water, icy wind, follow me, protect, roar etc

Edit: also blastoise gets fake out Edited by DoctorPBC

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i just can't seem to figure out how gengar is S tier rank

Icy wind, burns, immunity to fake out, good stab coverage, wide movepool, immunity to EQ,

And perish sing forces switches Edited by DoctorPBC

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rhydon>marrowak. marrowak cant switch in vs much and rhydon has the great defenses to take on the likes of snorlax, kangaskhan, aero, ect.... with L rod to absorb lightning and protect gyara and other waters/flyings. 

 

wheres the love for intimidate arcanine? immune to wow + insta heal + access to extreme speed with good coverage moves.

 

starmie should be mentioned as the best screen user. access to insta recovery with recover + nat cure + dual screens and the speed to set them up before most pokemon can hit. offensive moveset that is pretty much unparalleled. maybe move up a bit?

 

forrtress>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>cloyster. fort can set up dual screen and spikes and go boom.

 

jolteon------>A or A-

 

flygon C or C+

 

wobbu--------->B rank as best trapper/encore user. can even set up safe gaurd.

 

Duscklops------->A rank as best explosion absorber and wow user in doubles. it can even run i beam for dragons.

 

hariyama--------->B+ rank imo. bulky fake out set is a nice way to deal with all the normal/rock types and it's bulky enough to tank a few hits. fake out support and can easily set up with bulk up if needed.

 

smeargle------------>C rank (cause fuck smeargle and it's 10001 moves =/ )

 

pory2------------>B+ trace is really underestimated and pory2 can forced out half the metagame and use status to support the team.

 

gard------>C+ or b cause trace + screens is scary

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Update: Made some changes

 

Moved Up:

Dusclops - A

Jolteon - A

Hariyama - B+

Rhydon - B+ 

Blastoise - B

Forretress - B

Wobbuffet - B

Smeargle - C

 

Moved Down:

Marowak - B

Clefable - C

Cloyster - C

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I'd move Kanga way down. Fake Out aside, it can't do much.

 

You know I'd love to do that, but it is still the #1 used poke in the meta. Its speed, support ability, bulk, and normal STAB are a pretty powerful combination. Although a bulky Metagross pretty much poops on it, as well as a few other things. 

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Give it some time and the reign of Kanga will end, we have way too much things that deal well with it now.

 

We'll get some usage if we keep these tournaments rolling. Hopefully we can snatch up that usage from the PSL too. 

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