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May 2022-Movement Discussion Thread


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Dugtrio banned of UU, King's Rock banned from all tiers too, the only thing that probablly will be asked in this thread is the ban of Porygon-Z on UU. I will pick up my popcorn and watch.

Edited by caioxlive13
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49 minutes ago, caioxlive13 said:

Dugtrio banned of UU, King's Rock banned from all tiers too, the only thing that probablly will be asked in this thread is the ban of Porygon-Z on UU. I will pick up my popcorn and watch.

I wouldn't mind Blaziken moving up for a month or 2 to see how the meta not only changes but warped around it. I don't know anyone that makes a NU team and doesn't think about how to counter Blaziken. It's stab coverage hits the tier pretty hard and NU has limited options to be solid counters to it. Not to mention outside of the extremely common scarf set you can be caught off guard by a band or orb set and be 2 shot even on bulkier Pokemon. In conclusion you either have to guarantee you're faster or run one of the few pokes that resist both it's stabs. Also can't be burned.

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2 hours ago, epicdavenport said:

I wouldn't mind Blaziken moving up for a month or 2 to see how the meta not only changes but warped around it. I don't know anyone that makes a NU team and doesn't think about how to counter Blaziken. It's stab coverage hits the tier pretty hard and NU has limited options to be solid counters to it. Not to mention outside of the extremely common scarf set you can be caught off guard by a band or orb set and be 2 shot even on bulkier Pokemon. In conclusion you either have to guarantee you're faster or run one of the few pokes that resist both it's stabs. Also can't be burned.

in this point, you're correct. Most part of physical walls that usually are a problem to blaziken, go to UU by usage, So, blaziken now have a small number of counters and checks on tier. However, NU metagaming now is pretty much offensive. Or you win faster, or lose faster. On counterpart, UU start to being a defensive metagaming. Porygon-z, tier's best special offensive, are on risk of ban(too much players wanting this. Now, a new suspect test isn't a question if will happen, now is when will happen, because now doesn't have anything more broken that "veteran" players will care and ask their ban(before have, KR and Dugtrio) and their will come at full force to ask Porygon-Z's ban.)

Edited by caioxlive13
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3 hours ago, caioxlive13 said:

in this point, you're correct. Most part of physical walls that usually are a problem to blaziken, go to UU by usage, So, blaziken now have a small number of counters and checks on tier. However, NU metagaming now is pretty much offensive. Or you win faster, or lose faster. On counterpart, UU start to being a defensive metagaming. Porygon-z, tier's best special offensive, are on risk of ban(too much players wanting this. Now, a new suspect test isn't a question if will happen, now is when will happen, because now doesn't have anything more broken that "veteran" players will care and ask their ban(before have, KR and Dugtrio) and their will come at full force to ask Porygon-Z's ban.)

NU having a more offensive meta can be attributed to the high usage of Blaziken. As both of us said there aren't many counters to it meaning it's better to try and hit it first. I haven't read up on the classifications lately but doesn't this qualify as a offensive Uber? It's literally turned itself into a benchmark of the tier that if you don't pass you're likely going to lose.

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34 minutes ago, epicdavenport said:

NU having a more offensive meta can be attributed to the high usage of Blaziken. As both of us said there aren't many counters to it meaning it's better to try and hit it first. I haven't read up on the classifications lately but doesn't this qualify as a offensive Uber? It's literally turned itself into a benchmark of the tier that if you don't pass you're likely going to lose.

I agree, blaziken is a meta on tier, but we need to be thankfully that he are meta on NU. Because if they had speed boost...

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Blaziken has been touched on several times but has still yet to get its own discussion thread. Any tier council members care to share their views of it? Even if none see it as a issue you can't deny that it isn't meta defining/warping.

Edited by epicdavenport
Can't spell
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7 hours ago, CaptnBaklava said:

Blaziken is really good but one dimensional. There are pretty good ways to check the build it uses and when you know it playing around gets alot easier. 

 

I would like to see a meta without Blaziken anyway. 

Blaziken's problem is your variety of sets. They have stats to be a mixed pokémon(120 Atk, 110 Sp. Atk). Physical attack are higher, but some players abuse from this and make special or mixed sets, to deal a lot of damage on physical walls switch-ins that think they're safe. They don't have a big variety of special moves, but is possible to do something like: U-turn(Even special users use this, even if this is a Physical move xD)/Flamethrower/Focus Blast or Aura Sphere/Hidden Power Ice, Grass or on rare cases, Electric. Obviously top meta sets are Physical sets, but you can see some mixed sets working.

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On 4/28/2022 at 11:53 AM, epicdavenport said:

 I wouldn't mind Blaziken moving up for a month or 2 to see how the meta not only changes but warped around it. I don't know anyone that makes a NU team and doesn't think about how to counter Blaziken.

This is something normal, in each tier there will always be a threat that you must cover so that your team is good, it is not something new, nor is it that something is used only to specifically stop blaziken to take it as a centralization.

On 4/28/2022 at 11:53 AM, epicdavenport said:

It's stab coverage hits the tier pretty hard and NU has limited options to be solid counters to it. Not to mention outside of the extremely common scarf set you can be caught off guard by a band or orb set and be 2 shot even on bulkier Pokemon. In conclusion you either have to guarantee you're faster or run one of the few pokes that resist both it's stabs. Also can't be burned.

Blaziken does not have few answers, the fact of being locked in a play makes you need effort to predict what to throw, normally you will be throwing u-turn many times and there are things that are usually played rocky helmet, that combined with it being vulnerable to all the hazards will only make pivoting less easy. so you have to think well even when to hit and when not, here I will mention some counts withn los calculos incluidos:

Quagsire:

252 Atk Blaziken Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Quagsire: 78-93 (38.6 - 46%) -- 3HKO garantizado después de la recuperación de Leftovers

Altaria:

252 Atk Blaziken Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 204 Def Altaria: 42-51 (23 - 28%) -- 78.5% de probabilidad de 4HKO

Alomomola:

252 Atk Blaziken Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 81-96 (29.7 - 35.2%) -- 4HKO garantizado después de la recuperación de Leftovers

poliira:

252 Atk Blaziken Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Poliwrath: 73-87 (37 - 44.1%) -- 99.8% de probabilidad de 3HKO después de la recuperación de Leftovers

I am being the most usual, I also want to mention nidoqueen bold who receives 3 hits, in addition to mantine who is only hit by thunderpunch

Now, blaziken, even being a bandana, is outclassed by other things, like unfezant,rotom, etc, in addition to making a base 80 lasso like a gallade and even risking hitting, although the life orb set, like you say he can surprise and make holes defensively speaking that's the job of the wallbreak the problem with this would be if he had at least above average speed but 80 speed isn't the best in the world and ends up getting outclassed by a lot of pokemon on the level, same goes for cb blaziken, that power makes up for the lackluster speed it can have compared to other pokemon.

On 4/28/2022 at 5:10 PM, epicdavenport said:

Blaziken has been touched on several times but has still yet to get its own discussion thread. Any tier council members care to share their views of it?

Based on the offensive uber rating it should be a pokemon that can remove a lot of the level very easily or with no problem at all blaziken doesn't fit into this it could add more information to that uber rating but even if it does blaziken still I wouldn't find it.

Maybe at some point if the level is changed too much I will have a different point of view, but for now I don't see that it is a problem that should be addressed.

 

 

Edited by Huargensy
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I can agree that when making an NU team, I do think about how to prepare for Blaziken. It is undoubtedly a huge threat in the tier. And I won't repeat what's already been said.
But you know who else I prepare for?
Feraligatr - That thing is hella scary especially when it has a chance to set up. Blazikens do not wanna face em either, especially with the constant threat of aqua jet.
Ambipom - Probably a HUGE part of the reason why most Blazikens are scarfed lol. And even then, Fake outs hurt a lot to those who don't resist em. There aren't too many safe switch-ins either with the coverage it can have.
Golbat - A great support and a huge pain to take down if you don't have the proper moves for it. Can tank the fighting types in most cases and knock em out with Brave Bird.
Rising threats like Lilligant and Ninjask. And even they have their ways of dealing with Blaziken.
I can keep listing more, but the point is that NU's got threats to worry about as much as Blaziken. It's tough to make a team that consistently wins because of this.

But I will mention one more thing. NU rain teams. Ohhhh boy. Even if they're not that common, I can tell you that they make the big bad Blaziken look like Chicken Little. 

Edited by StrengthPolicy
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