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Rache

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5 hours ago, OrangeManiac said:

3c321c01304af8c227402f1395e37437.png

 

Sorry but what is this

Its physical and special attack stats are actually equal. While its ice move (Icicle Crash most of the time, sometimes Ice Punch or Icicle Spear) is a bit weaker than Ice Beam, this set can punish specially defensive switch-ins that think they're safe. Usually they would be, since 7/8 builds carry special moves instead.

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7 hours ago, Rache said:

Its physical and special attack stats are actually equal. While its ice move (Icicle Crash most of the time, sometimes Ice Punch or Icicle Spear) is a bit weaker than Ice Beam, this set can punish specially defensive switch-ins that think they're safe. Usually they would be, since 7/8 builds carry special moves instead.

I don't really mind having physical sets on typically special Pokemon and vice versa, some of them have been great. This specific set just seemed so all over the place to me. Spikes on a choice-locked Pokemon and Wake-Up Slap just seemed way too weird. Good to hear it's only 1 in 8 sets though, I got this specific set 2/2 times I had Froslass.

 

12 hours ago, caioxlive13 said:

a physical set of Froslass. Spikes you can use after trick to pick your opponent with a suprise.

Nice think.

Thanks, I almost forgot to Ignore your forum posts for a second.

 

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13 hours ago, Rache said:

Its physical and special attack stats are actually equal. While its ice move (Icicle Crash most of the time, sometimes Ice Punch or Icicle Spear) is a bit weaker than Ice Beam, this set can punish specially defensive switch-ins that think they're safe. Usually they would be, since 7/8 builds carry special moves instead.

Database of Frosslass in Pokédex:

75 Physical Attack
75 Special Attack

Use a Physical set to suprise special defenders
STONKS

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def23b67cd25b5f329d3792bf27b7041.png

 

Gonna have to say I think this set is a bit too memeworthy for Randoms. Because of Shuckle's low speed it needs arguably 3 Rock Polish and Power Trick to do anything in any scenario which is 4 turns of set up. Setting up Rock Polish already is a huge give away what is going to happen and only works if opponent has no clue what is happening. I know some Pokemon are just naturally useless but Shuckle really isn't one and has a few defensive sets you don't hate to have. So I would drop this set completely.

 

Edited by OrangeManiac
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On 11/23/2021 at 6:55 PM, Rache said:

 

Suggest to random:

- If none mon of some Level(example: 73) maked the win rate cutoff to Level Down, except in Level 73, the best win rate of level will automatically level down, even if below 52%.
 - If none mon of some Level(example: 73) maked the win rate cutoff to Level Up, except in Level 86, the worst win rate of level will automatically level up, even if above 48%.
 
 - Lower Level Possible: Add a Level 72 for mons in randoms, that go over well. Level more lower will be needed when some mons(Garchomp), that are too OP, comes in.
 - Higher Level Possible: Add a Level 88 for mons in Randoms, that didn't perfomed well. Some mons are extremlly worse(Corsola) and the situation will be more bad when some mons(Rotom-mow) be added.

Legendarys: When added, Legendarys will have a Restriction: None could be in a Level more higher than 70, only one will be rolled per team, and all legendarys that are banned in Battle Frontier, is Banned in mode(except non-ubers).

Hidden Abilitys: When added, will have some restrictions: Ubers Hidden Abillitys will be banned(Blaziken will cry), none team can be rolled with more than one Hidden Ability(Reducing Poison heal Gliscor 's chance to appear.)

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On 12/16/2021 at 12:35 AM, Rache said:

This set can punish specially defensive switch-ins that think they're safe. Usually they would be, since 7/8 builds carry special moves instead.

Correct. High Ladder always think that one pokemon only have one set , and incentivate the high numbers of novices possible, that only this set is correct. the proof of this: Doesn't hard to found two Copypasted teams, in Matchmaking. Copypasted Sets, and Copypasted Weakness(Like a stall/semi-stall. Very Common, and extremlly weak to Hax. Lucky to me, i don't use one. Imagem)
Not for other reason, things more diferent doesn't work too well against low ladder, but works very well against high ladder. Example: I use a Muscle Band Jolly Ambipon, to pray opponents to they think that ambipon is Choice Item(Because i don't use Fake Out) adamant. Works very well, high ladder players always throw Scizor/Garchomp to resist to one Elemental Punch, but i have another to do 4x more damage. And my nape, that uses Vaccum Wave instead of Mach Punch, to Blissey Toxic Spammers think that my Infernape is Special and they're safe. Always OHKO with close combat.


When add Infernape to Randoms, and Ambipon, here is two Blueprints of Sets:

Infernape @ Life Orb/Focus Sash
- Vaccum Wave
- Overheat
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat

Ambipon @ Muscle Band/Focus Sash
 - Fire Punch
 - Ice Punch
 - Thunderpunch
- Pursuit

Edited by caioxlive13
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  • 2 weeks later...

This month's level changes. The numbers you see here are different from what you see in the statistics UI as movements were based only on the matches played after the build updates.

 

Leveling DOWN: Pokemon that performed too well.

Spoiler

- Charizard: Total WR: 51.26 / Highest WR: 54.13 / Reduced level 78 -> 77
- Raichu: Total WR: 51.29 / Highest WR: 55.57 / Reduced level 81 -> 80
- Nidoqueen: Total WR: 51.66 / Highest WR: 55.12 / Reduced level 78 -> 77
- Golbat: Total WR: 52.01 / Reduced level 78 -> 77
- Vileplume: Total WR: 51.74 / Highest WR: 54.08 / Reduced level 82 -> 81
- Primeape: Total WR: 52.29 / Reduced level 81 -> 80
- Arcanine: Total WR: 52.39 / Reduced level 76 -> 75
- Poliwrath: Total WR: 51.43 / Highest WR: 55.19 / Reduced level 78 -> 77
- Golem: Total WR: 51.00 / Highest WR: 54.48 / Reduced level 79 -> 78
- Rapidash: Total WR: 51.46 / Highest WR: 54.09 / Reduced level 82 -> 81
- Slowbro: Total WR: 49.71 / Highest WR: 54.84 / Reduced level 79 -> 78
- Dodrio: Total WR: 51.91 / Highest WR: 56.46 / Reduced level 79 -> 78
- Hitmonchan: Total WR: 50.72 / Highest WR: 55.27 / Reduced level 78 -> 77
- Scyther: Total WR: 53.19 / Reduced level 77 -> 76
- Electabuzz: Total WR: 52.26 / Reduced level 80 -> 79
- Pinsir: Total WR: 52.39 / Reduced level 79 -> 78
- Gyarados: Total WR: 52.01 / Reduced level 73 -> 72
- Snorlax: Total WR: 51.84 / Highest WR: 54.57 / Reduced level 75 -> 74
- Typhlosion: Total WR: 52.78 / Reduced level 79 -> 78
- Jumpluff: Total WR: 50.45 / Highest WR: 54.96 / Reduced level 80 -> 79
- Espeon: Total WR: 51.32 / Highest WR: 54.19 / Reduced level 76 -> 75
- Scizor: Total WR: 52.08 / Reduced level 73 -> 72
- Heracross: Total WR: 51.58 / Highest WR: 55.60 / Reduced level 74 -> 73
- Ursaring: Total WR: 52.66 / Reduced level 79 -> 78
- Donphan: Total WR: 52.04 / Reduced level 77 -> 76
- Porygon2: Total WR: 50.87 / Highest WR: 55.80 / Reduced level 74 -> 73
- Miltank: Total WR: 51.63 / Highest WR: 54.39 / Reduced level 77 -> 76
- Swampert: Total WR: 51.27 / Highest WR: 56.07 / Reduced level 75 -> 74
- Linoone: Total WR: 50.69 / Highest WR: 55.35 / Reduced level 78 -> 77
- Ludicolo: Total WR: 50.72 / Highest WR: 54.55 / Reduced level 81 -> 80
- Swellow: Total WR: 50.41 / Highest WR: 55.81 / Reduced level 78 -> 77
- Aggron: Total WR: 50.87 / Highest WR: 54.08 / Reduced level 81 -> 80
- Roselia: Total WR: 52.20 / Reduced level 83 -> 82
- Grumpig: Total WR: 51.39 / Highest WR: 54.53 / Reduced level 82 -> 81
- Altaria: Total WR: 52.07 / Reduced level 83 -> 82
- Whiscash: Total WR: 51.41 / Highest WR: 55.02 / Reduced level 81 -> 80
- Absol: Total WR: 49.83 / Highest WR: 55.62 / Reduced level 79 -> 78
- Huntail: Total WR: 50.25 / Highest WR: 54.07 / Reduced level 81 -> 80
- Gorebyss: Total WR: 50.37 / Highest WR: 58.61 / Reduced level 80 -> 79
- Relicanth: Total WR: 51.47 / Highest WR: 55.30 / Reduced level 81 -> 80
- Honchkrow: Total WR: 50.60 / Highest WR: 55.12 / Reduced level 79 -> 78
- Weavile: Total WR: 52.28 / Reduced level 75 -> 74
- Lickilicky: Total WR: 50.20 / Highest WR: 55.83 / Reduced level 81 -> 80
- Rhyperior: Total WR: 51.01 / Highest WR: 55.13 / Reduced level 77 -> 76
- Togekiss: Total WR: 52.67 / Reduced level 75 -> 74
- Leafeon: Total WR: 51.73 / Highest WR: 55.16 / Reduced level 81 -> 80
- Gliscor: Total WR: 51.80 / Highest WR: 54.86 / Reduced level 75 -> 74
- Mamoswine: Total WR: 53.36 / Reduced level 77 -> 76
- Porygon-Z: Total WR: 52.57 / Reduced level 77 -> 76
- Gallade: Total WR: 53.98 / Reduced level 79 -> 78



Leveling UP: Pokemon that performed poorly.
 

Spoiler

- Butterfree: Total WR: 47.53 / Increased level 83 -> 84
- Pikachu: Total WR: 47.61 / Increased level 81 -> 82
- Parasect: Total WR: 46.69 / Increased level 85 -> 86
- Seaking: Total WR: 46.57 / Increased level 83 -> 84
- Dragonite: Total WR: 47.98 / Increased level 74 -> 75
- Ledian: Total WR: 45.81 / Increased level 86 -> 87
- Sunflora: Total WR: 45.90 / Increased level 86 -> 87
- Quagsire: Total WR: 47.61 / Increased level 79 -> 80
- Shuckle: Total WR: 46.43 / Increased level 83 -> 84
- Octillery: Total WR: 47.83 / Increased level 83 -> 84
- Delibird: Total WR: 46.84 / Increased level 86 -> 87
- Smeargle: Total WR: 44.93 / Increased level 86 -> 87
- Dustox: Total WR: 47.62 / Increased level 83 -> 84
- Exploud: Total WR: 47.97 / Increased level 84 -> 85
- Mawile: Total WR: 46.66 / Increased level 85 -> 86
- Spinda: Total WR: 43.44 / Increased level 86 -> 87
- Cacturne: Total WR: 47.66 / Increased level 84 -> 85
- Castform: Total WR: 47.42 / Increased level 86 -> 87
- Kecleon: Total WR: 47.58 / Increased level 85 -> 86
- Luvdisc: Total WR: 45.16 / Increased level 86 -> 87
- Magnezone: Total WR: 47.45 / Increased level 75 -> 76
- Probopass: Total WR: 46.37 / Increased level 81 -> 82

The best performing builds for December were:

-Shell Smash Gorebyss (58.61%)

-Attacker Gallade (57.72%)

-3 Attacks Mamoswine (56.93%)

 

________________________________________

 

To address a bit more feedback;

On 12/17/2021 at 3:22 AM, OrangeManiac said:

def23b67cd25b5f329d3792bf27b7041.png

 

Gonna have to say I think this set is a bit too memeworthy for Randoms. Because of Shuckle's low speed it needs arguably 3 Rock Polish and Power Trick to do anything in any scenario which is 4 turns of set up. Setting up Rock Polish already is a huge give away what is going to happen and only works if opponent has no clue what is happening. I know some Pokemon are just naturally useless but Shuckle really isn't one and has a few defensive sets you don't hate to have. So I would drop this set completely.

 

I see you don't like fun. Removed for next build update.

 

________________________________________

 

On 12/19/2021 at 7:25 PM, caioxlive13 said:

Suggest to random:

- If none mon of some Level(example: 73) maked the win rate cutoff to Level Down, except in Level 73, the best win rate of level will automatically level down, even if below 52%.
 - If none mon of some Level(example: 73) maked the win rate cutoff to Level Up, except in Level 86, the worst win rate of level will automatically level up, even if above 48%.
 

The goal of the level adjustments isn't to keep things constantly moving, it's to reach a point in which every species is as balanced for the meta as they can be. The fewer changes that happen, the better.

 

On 12/19/2021 at 7:25 PM, caioxlive13 said:

Suggest to random:


Legendarys: When added, Legendarys will have a Restriction: None could be in a Level more higher than 70, only one will be rolled per team, and all legendarys that are banned in Battle Frontier, is Banned in mode(except non-ubers).

Hidden Abilitys: When added, will have some restrictions: Ubers Hidden Abillitys will be banned(Blaziken will cry), none team can be rolled with more than one Hidden Ability(Reducing Poison heal Gliscor 's chance to appear.)

Legendaries and hidden abilities will be balanced the same way everything else is, and will be added only when they're available to players.

 

A lv70 restriction for legendaries would be extremely arbitrary and serve only to hinder the worse ones. Articuno for example would likely be a liability with a poor winrate that needs more levels to fairly compete, while something better like Latios would likely fall below lv70 on its own.

 

Hidden abilities don't need any extra restrictions either. If we limited players to 1/team, rolling a mediocre hidden ability gimps your team unnecessarily by locking you out of getting something better. If a hidden ability makes something significantly better, that will be reflected by its level. We're not planning to ever give players access to Speed Boost Blaziken, so it won't appear in randoms either.

 

 

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On 02/01/2022 at 13:00, Rache said:

 

 

The goal of the level adjustments isn't to keep things constantly moving, it's to reach a point in which every species is as balanced for the meta as they can be. The fewer changes that happen, the better.

 

Legendaries and hidden abilities will be balanced the same way everything else is, and will be added only when they're available to players.

 

A lv70 restriction for legendaries would be extremely arbitrary and serve only to hinder the worse ones. Articuno for example would likely be a liability with a poor winrate that needs more levels to fairly compete, while something better like Latios would likely fall below lv70 on its own.

 

 

I agree, some Legendarys will be leveling up, to higher than 70. However, is good put all to start on lvl 70 or below, to see which legendarys are OP(Mewtwo, Mew, Rayquaza) and which don't are(Articuno). 

About HA, this limit can be applied only for HA that are OU/UU and leave some mons worse to deal with, like Poison Heal Gliscor.

And one question, we can suggest Blueprints of sets here? If yes, i want to suggest two blueprints(Ignore Pikachu blueprint. I want to take Screenshot of Blueprint of Flareon and Ambipon, however Pikachu comes in Print anyway.)
image.png.554e6d0ee4f1fd152c3944856c499535.png

(The set of flareon is a Pure offense, that can be cover itself over well. Choice Scarf is to pass some mons, because flareon is too slow.
And for Ambipon, is for pray opponent, to him think that you have Choice Band or Scarf, and switch thinking they're safe. (Knowing Randoms, is 100% possible that have sets of ambipon with Choice item. Can put choice items in this blueprint to pray even more). )

Edited by caioxlive13
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On 1/6/2022 at 7:20 AM, Makarovs said:

84849dcf1daa6a9102c1a98d1f968aa7.png

 

I'm really curious about what i can do with curse here

This set seems dedicated to answer to anything that can setup whether it be offensively or defensively. It is very bad. But Curse fits the pool (Dusclops is a Ghost type pokemon). 

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Speaking about Shuckle, i found that this set with Power Split have the Ivs and Evs to 31 and 85 respectively in both attacks. I don't know if it is intentional but it should be 0 Ivs and Evs to maximise the effect of Power Split (I don't think the damage difference of wrap will be noteworthy lol)Shuckle.png.b8aa2c96059f373488fd187a3a080701.png

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13 hours ago, DaftKitteh said:

I kind of get the use this set was trying to find, the ultimate stall-mon, but we gotta ask: Is it fun? 

2rYMOQM.png

Thanks for putting it here, it's an oversight. When giving it a healing move, most builds have it pick between Roost and Softboiled, but it seems that it had these as possibilities for two slots here, meaning that it could end up with both. Removed Softboiled for the next build update.

 

On 1/16/2022 at 10:32 AM, Lamps said:

Speaking about Shuckle, i found that this set with Power Split have the Ivs and Evs to 31 and 85 respectively in both attacks. I don't know if it is intentional but it should be 0 Ivs and Evs to maximise the effect of Power Split (I don't think the damage difference of wrap will be noteworthy lol)Shuckle.png.b8aa2c96059f373488fd187a3a080701.png

I'll request setting them to 0 when Power Split is present, thanks. It was forgotten when setting other criteria for reducing stats.

 

On 1/6/2022 at 12:20 AM, Makarovs said:

84849dcf1daa6a9102c1a98d1f968aa7.png

 

I'm really curious about what i can do with curse here

This is a general utility build with a large number of possibilities, but it could definitely be better as Curse/Haze accomplish a lot of the same things. It's been split into two for the next build update to make its move choices a bit more meaningful, thanks for pointing it out.

 

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

Work on the rest of gen 4 is starting. There's no ETA yet, but something I'm unsure of is whether the pull rates for Rotom forms should be reduced as they're likely all going to be built similarly to each other when I get to them.

 

Should all Rotom forms be treated as individual Pokemon, giving the species an effective 6x pull rate? I think this is how Showdown does it.

Should all 6 forms be treated as a single Pokemon and just randomize its form like Unown? Still with sets designed per-form of course.

Is a middle ground preferable where the rate is reduced but not as drastically?

Should this apply to the slightly more unique Wormadam forms too?

 

Species clause will still apply regardless of how it's handled. Feedback would be appreciated.

Edited by Rache
Made option 2 more clear.
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19 minutes ago, Rache said:

Should all 6 forms be treated as a single Pokemon and just randomize its form like Unown?

No way, imo. Unown has one attack and that's about it, here each Rotom carries one special move, has different typing and can utilize different moveset, dependant on it's typing (for example, Rotom-Fridge (frost) won't really utilize a more defensive Defog/ Pain split/ Volt Switch/ Special move set very well due to it's weak defensive typing which also makes it weak to most of rock setters, while Rotom-H/ Mow/ Wash/ standard can use it pretty well).

22 minutes ago, Rache said:

Should all Rotom forms be treated as individual Pokemon, giving the species an effective 6x pull rate? I think this is how Showdown does it.

Is a middle ground preferable where the rate is reduced but not as drastically?

I think the rate should be slightly reduced, considering the fact that there are several Rotom forms. I wouldn't want to give it an effective 6x pull rate as playing Rotom in every match would be pretty boring (and that's what we are trying to avoid when playing randbats, right?)

24 minutes ago, Rache said:

Should this apply to the slightly more unique Wormadam forms too?

I think that each Wormadam is much more unique than Rotom- not only when it comes to typing, but also movepool which can be utilized by each form. It's not like Wormadams got just one special move and different typing, each form uses completely different moves.

 

Just my opinions, though

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4 hours ago, Rache said:

Work on the rest of gen 4 is starting. There's no ETA yet, but something I'm unsure of is whether the pull rates for Rotom forms should be reduced as they're likely all going to be built similarly to each other when I get to them.

 

Should all Rotom forms be treated as individual Pokemon, giving the species an effective 6x pull rate? I think this is how Showdown does it.

Should all 6 forms be treated as a single Pokemon and just randomize its form like Unown? Still with sets designed per-form of course.

Is a middle ground preferable where the rate is reduced but not as drastically?

Should this apply to the slightly more unique Wormadam forms too?

 

Species clause will still apply regardless of how it's handled. Feedback would be appreciated.

Apply more than one form of rotom is a good idea, however a filter to limit of a max of 2 can be maked. Each rotom has your unique strategy, however will be boring face 6x mons with 105 on both defenses iirc. And this can avoid a conflict, because while rotom-frost will be on a higher level to do something, the Rotom-wash certainly need to be on level lower.
 

Spoiler

For new mon being introducted, can apply the follow levels, to start:

20% or more usage on OU = Level 71.
4,36% - 20% usage on OU = LvL 73
20% or more usage on UU = Level 75.
9% - 20% usage on UU = LeveL 76
4,36% - 9% usage on UU = Level 78
20% or more usage on NU = Level 79.
9% - 20% usage on NU = LeveL 81
4,36% - 9% usage on NU = Level 83
Below 4,36% usage on NU = Level 85

Obviously this level changes after some months. This is only one mecanism for determine in which level a mon can be introduced, because someones will certain need more levels, like Rotom-frost, while Garchomp must need to be Lower than level 71.

Other suggestions to Randoms:

Until legendarys being added, If some mon has on level 69 and Downgrade, then it will be banned from tier or something like this because it's broken.
46% or less winrate downgrade two levels instead of one.

Edited by Rache
Put off topic text into a spoiler. Not doing what's inside of it though.
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  • 1 month later...
  • 4 weeks later...
On 12/8/2021 at 1:34 PM, OrangeManiac said:

I'm not sure are we supposed to also comment about overpowered sets but I think Shedinja with U-Turn is just absolute BS in randoms environment. If you don't have an entry hazard user, it's almost unbeatable. Whenever you go to your Pokemon that has a move on Shedinja, they're already gone.

And it goes without saying that he doesn't normally learn U-turn, strange mistake from the devs here...

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On 4/29/2022 at 12:22 AM, Sashaolin said:

And it goes without saying that he doesn't normally learn U-turn, strange mistake from the devs here...

Thank you for your report, this will be dealt with in the future. 

 

Not defending our mistakes, but they do happen, and we rely to some extent on players like you reporting these things when they do occur. There are like 500 obtainable pokemon with hundreds of moves in their learnlists across multiple generations, its a very difficult thing for us to catch without your help and we appreciate that.

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On 4/30/2022 at 4:48 PM, Munya said:

Thank you for your report, this will be dealt with in the future. 

 

Not defending our mistakes, but they do happen, and we rely to some extent on players like you reporting these things when they do occur. There are like 500 obtainable pokemon with hundreds of moves in their learnlists across multiple generations, its a very difficult thing for us to catch without your help and we appreciate that.

It's a pleasure to help, catching all the bugs/mistakes is for sure hard work, don't take my post as blame, I've just been surprised that such a thing went uncaught for so long.

 

By the way, there is another thing that can be fixed regarding Shedinja: it's immune to Night Shade while it shouldn't be the case.

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On 5/2/2022 at 12:16 AM, Sashaolin said:

It's a pleasure to help, catching all the bugs/mistakes is for sure hard work, don't take my post as blame, I've just been surprised that such a thing went uncaught for so long.

 

By the way, there is another thing that can be fixed regarding Shedinja: it's immune to Night Shade while it shouldn't be the case.

Night Shade doesn't do suppereffective damage. He only check immunitys, but ignores resistances and weakness. To hit shedinja, only 2 types of damage hit him: Supereffective damage and Residual Damage.

Edited by caioxlive13
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3 hours ago, caioxlive13 said:

Night Shade doesn't do suppereffective damage. He only check immunitys, but ignores resistances and weakness. To hit shedinja, only 2 types of damage hit him: Supereffective damage and Residual Damage.

Night Shade should bypass Wonder Guard due to its typing despite not including a super effective message. It's an actual issue that's been fixed for the next update.

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On 5/3/2022 at 10:17 PM, caioxlive13 said:

Night Shade doesn't do suppereffective damage. He only check immunitys, but ignores resistances and weakness. To hit shedinja, only 2 types of damage hit him: Supereffective damage and Residual Damage.

I make sure I'm right before I report.
You're the kind of person who talks a lot to say nothing, aren't you?

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