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April-Movement Discussion Thread


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Suspect test p2 for the reasons i have already mentioned in uu discussion. Haxorus and pz might need new testing because of the huge changes the meta has seen since their last test but in my opinion first we should look at the existing problem the tier has and that is p2. 

In the case we dont suspect test p2 then re-test pz because its a specially oriented pokemon that is able to break through p2, it hasnt got many checks but there are 2 and most of the best scarf users in the tier are able to revenge kill it. ( i dont think pz is gonna be healthy for the tier but i dont think p2 is also. So in my opinion it shows inconsistency in tiering and this requires fixing one way or another) 

Edited by Umbramol
So many grammatical mistakes jesus.
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10 hours ago, PoseidonWrath said:

 

really sad how alot of ppl complain with stuff like : Oooh only gigalith/mantine can handle typloshion, bcs thats simple not true

 

My bad my bad, I'll re-write my post:

Only like 2 VIABLE Pokemon can handle most sets of Typhlosion. And even then Mixed Typhlo (which should be the best now that I think more about it) can deal with pretty much any check that it might have, have fun desciphering what moves it has and what it doesn't meanwhile it kills your entire team.

It really can do nothing vs Duggy though, so at least that's really good. Unless scarf but like come one what is that trash item?

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I agree with these changes.

And besides, I  think that Azumarill can be really a threat in the tier,But there are plenty of checks for Azumarill, it's just that people don't play them .

 his arrival will change the tier a lot and people will FINALLY be able to become original in their teambuild, so that can be a good thing

 

(ps : so glad slowbro is coming back)

 

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13 hours ago, Munya said:

This is probably whats happening by the looks of it, also discussed Lucario and Haxorus, haxorus got a resounding no, Lucario was a bit more split but still voted no.

Interesting, can we get some TC input on why P-Z but not Hax? P-Z has way more immediate power than Haxorus and in a way even has more spamable STAB. It has more potential sets than Hax that need a larger variety of answers and it can carry Trick which is.... tricky. Especially with Jelli moving out of the tier it's curious that P-Z is being considered for a retest. What are the metashifts that justify a retest of P-Z, while not justifying a retest for Hax? I'm curious.

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2 hours ago, ThinkNicer said:

Interesting, can we get some TC input on why P-Z but not Hax? P-Z has way more immediate power than Haxorus and in a way even has more spamable STAB. It has more potential sets than Hax that need a larger variety of answers and it can carry Trick which is.... tricky. Especially with Jelli moving out of the tier it's curious that P-Z is being considered for a retest. What are the metashifts that justify a retest of P-Z, while not justifying a retest for Hax? I'm curious.

ye jellicent best pz awnser  :PepeKMS: (dusclops got also high usage but ye without facking jellicent pz is broken) 

Edited by Quinn010
Ban electrode
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3 hours ago, ThinkNicer said:

Interesting, can we get some TC input on why P-Z but not Hax? P-Z has way more immediate power than Haxorus and in a way even has more spamable STAB. It has more potential sets than Hax that need a larger variety of answers and it can carry Trick which is.... tricky. Especially with Jelli moving out of the tier it's curious that P-Z is being considered for a retest. What are the metashifts that justify a retest of P-Z, while not justifying a retest for Hax? I'm curious.

1- Access to close combat on a lot of mons, including Haxorus (Both helps hax and hinders pz)

2- Access to empoleon and metagross (hinders pz)

3- Loss of Mandibuzz, aka best haxorus counter.

edit: UU also gained access to Rotom-Heat, which only boosts Haxorus even further.

Edited by pachima
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1 hour ago, pachima said:

2- Access to empoleon and metagross (hinders pz)

Metagross I agree to an extent, but it fears Tri Attack Burn and is basically forced to be full SpDef and run Pursuit to punish P-z

 

Even full Calm Empoleon nearly gets 2hko'd by Timid itemless Thunderbolt so I don't see how that helps the case, I agree that it makes Tri Attack spam less rewarding but it also does nothing to punish it in return and is very easily chipped. We can't forget that Tri Attack isn't the only move that P-z has access to.

 

If we're talking about true defensive answers to P-z I think the most mentionable are Porygon2 and Gigalith because they both tank all of its moves very well and, in P2's case, have reliable recovery. I can't remember if P2 was in UU the last time P-z was in the tier, but if it wasn't then imo that's the single biggest change that might help to make P-z less overpowered. And even then, it has a very low chance to be 2hko'd by timid specs Tri Attack after rocks. The Nasty Plot set is another matter, though.

 

It's also worth noting that every fighting type in UU is slower than P-z without scarf. But I agree that CC is very common on faster non-stab users too and will make RKing or forcing a switch a little easier.

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5 hours ago, Zymogen said:

Metagross I agree to an extent

252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Tri Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Metagross: 76-90 (49 - 58%) -- 97.7% chance to 2HKO

Your Metagross better get some HP/SpDef investment because this is going to hurt.

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39 minutes ago, gbwead said:

252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Tri Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Metagross: 76-90 (49 - 58%) -- 97.7% chance to 2HKO

Your Metagross better get some HP/SpDef investment because this is going to hurt.

That’s why I said it’s forced to be full spdef

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When you consider the tier changes over the last year, UU gained a lot of faster mons like Staraptor, Arcanine coming down from OU that can easily revenge kill PZ

It also gained Metagross which somewhat helps 

However the timing seems bad to add PZ considering Jellicent is leaving the tier, it would almost have made more sense to consider this change a few seasons ago 

 

About it being totally broken PZ's speed tier is about average for the tier so I doubt Specs will be that threatening as gb's mentioning in his calc

As for Nasty Plot, I wonder what it can actually set onto considering his type won't allow much free turns (there's barely any ghost moves used in the tier)

As for scarf it would be slower than all other common scarfers (besides Rotom which would suck on a scarf set after the tier shift) 

 

What is disturbing me the most is why tf are players supposed to adapt to the new meta in 2 days for the most important tournament in the season ? It's really stupid and hinders my will to actually play the game all season long and learn a meta that doesn't exist for the final exam

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On 26/3/2021 at 19:45, Munya said:

Por el bien de la discusión, voy a enumerar todo debajo de los puntos de corte, incluso BL mons, esto no significa que BL mons se estén moviendo hacia abajo.

4,36% para moverse en cualquier dirección este mes, final de temporada inicio de una nueva temporada.

 

Subiendo a OU:

Gelatina

 

BL1 Mons por debajo del límite:

Lucario
Porygon-z
Haxorus
 

Bajando a UU:

Swampert
Gastrodon
 

Subiendo a UU:

Electrodo

 

Bajando a NU:

Slowbro
Typhlosion
Azumarill
Gigalith
 

Voto por gigalith y slowbro en NU

 

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On 3/26/2021 at 11:36 PM, PoseidonWrath said:

then ppl need to adapt and use new things to handle those mons 

 

a great example that can safely come in a typloshion is spdef poliwrath

and who knows maybe we see some people use new mons to handle such mons.

Typloshion cant touch lampent as well :) 

Hariyama with thickfat,
Frillish (people already start naming this mon for azumarill)

and maybe some more idk ,

 

really sad how alot of ppl complain with stuff like : Oooh only gigalith/mantine can handle typloshion, bcs thats simple not true

 

This why wrath is bae

Edited by xStarr
Azu n Typhlo in NU is fun. Vote Yes.
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I dont know where to ask this so i will ask it here. PorygonZ is subject to test as shown when you choose it in your party for ranked games. Info about this testing is gothered by any uu game played? And if thats the case how would someone decide that said game is an accurate representation to judge porygonZ's influence in the tier? Or are we just checking its winrate and what pokemon's usage changes alongside? Or are we gonna gother information by what players think about it? I think we need explanation on this testing so we know how we can contribute to it or facilitate the proccess in any way we can @Munya

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