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REVERT THE BATON PASS CHANGES


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Seriously. Competitive moves should NOT be balanced around pve bs. that is a move that defines team archetypes in little cup and doubles, even moreso, with the changes it will most likelly remain banned from nu/uu/ou anyways because it brings interactions that are foreign to the original games metas  ie: fast psychic/ghost pokemon could use it to escape pursuit trapping which was never its originally intended move. It wasnt also intended to be a cheaper, more widely spread version of u-turn or volt switch.

 

Make it so it doesn't work vs npcs or whatever idc but just..

 

DO NOT CHANGE THE COMPETITIVE METAGAME PLEASE, I THOUGHT WE'D AGREED ON THAT.

Edited by iJulian
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Overall I like the recent update because of Sinnoh but I don't understand why the devs would want to change Baton Pass. I agree with OP in it being reverted back to the way it was originally was but also in it keeping the mechanic where it passes stat changes. This update has killed one of (if not the best) money makers in the game. First berry farming now e4 runs. 

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23 hours ago, Popolocrois said:

ikr, why would it called Baton Pass if it can't Pass the remaining stats, my e4 pokes are useless now

it's  meant to be like that, to further nerf e4 runs, aka pvm. Peasants.

I don't understand is why such changes also have to be implemented in competitive, it's just dumb.

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  • 2 weeks later...

After looking through for a while on topics like this, 

it’s fair to say that these things happen for the sole purpose to keep things interesting & fair for others. 
allowing new players to not be spammed with the same Pokémon/move sets. 
while also allowing comp players to develop new ways to play.

its really a matter of balance. 
 

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I don't care about Baton Pass, but I agree it shouldn't have been changed. Baton Pass without stat changes is worthless.

PokeMMO was the promise to get original Pokemon games into an MMO, but for years now the devs went and changed so much, officially for the sake of balance. They should not. They should leave the games as they are, and only ban things in multiplayer official events.

(I still love this game though!)

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What about at least reverting it in PvP? Because right now, despite still being called by the same name, it's a completely different move. It's a whole new move that (idk if it can for sure since I don't really play the game) can bypass abilities like arena trap/shadow tag and count as a free switch-out in situations it wouldn't otherwise exist. If BPass is too broken to be in the non-LC tiers why not just restrict it to PvP? Literally just make the move illegal in PvE battles, delete it as a move Pokemon can learn any way except from a tutor, that way it can only be purposefully added and not mess up anyone's story run by disabling PvE battles for them until they replace the move.

 

Doesn't this current decision work differently than the principles decisions like Draco Meteor being removed from Hydreigon's learnset were made on? 

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On 2/6/2020 at 6:54 AM, DibzAgain said:

What about at least reverting it in PvP? Because right now, despite still being called by the same name, it's a completely different move. It's a whole new move that (idk if it can for sure since I don't really play the game) can bypass abilities like arena trap/shadow tag and count as a free switch-out in situations it wouldn't otherwise exist. If BPass is too broken to be in the non-LC tiers why not just restrict it to PvP? Literally just make the move illegal in PvE battles, delete it as a move Pokemon can learn any way except from a tutor, that way it can only be purposefully added and not mess up anyone's story run by disabling PvE battles for them until they replace the move.

 

Doesn't this current decision work differently than the principles decisions like Draco Meteor being removed from Hydreigon's learnset were made on? 

It could already do those things, vanilla mechanic.  Nothing custom was added to it, the only thing that happened was one piece of it was removed.

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4 minutes ago, Munya said:

It could already do those things, vanilla mechanic.  Nothing custom was added to it, the only thing that happened was one piece of it was removed.

Its not one piece, its a huge important chunk of pieces that made it viable. You are just trying once again to find excuses to validate bad reasonings.

 

Pve nerf sure, but why mess with pvp? Legit makes no sense.

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14 minutes ago, Munya said:

It could already do those things, vanilla mechanic.  Nothing custom was added to it, the only thing that happened was one piece of it was removed.

So are you guys going to remove pieces out of other moves?

Overheat, Draco Meteor, Leaf Storm, Super Power, Close Combat, Shell Smash, Hammer Arm, all these moves lower your stats. Please remove the stat reduction.

 

Stop trying to downplay it, passing stats was what Baton Pass was made for and you guys butchered it. No one used Baton Pass just to pass Ingrain or Substitute.

Just admit that you guys don't know how to balance it and I'll accept the changes.

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4 hours ago, Munya said:

There was nothing balanced about it before, it was banned, now its not.

That is literally the worst response you could've come up with. it's so hilariously senseless it actually tilted me to oblivion, let's see..

 

Hello??? First, it wasn't banned in doubles or lc, now it wont be used anywhere :) Balanced amirite?

 

Stop trying to make a pve balance change pass for a pvp one, it just wont work and it's infuriating. or at this point, take the 10% chance to freeze out of the ice moves because its unbalanced and why the heck not.

Even better, if yall enjoy taking stuff away so much, go all in on it and take every secondary effect in the game away from every move so we can have a perfectly balanced, non rng reliant game :))

 

If you are gonna follow your (terribly bad) argument to change things in order to make them "balanced" then actually own it and act accordingly. Make Murkow hit 17 base speed max so it can be unbanned from lc. Take speed boost off yanma so it can be unbanned there too, if yall gonna be meddling with balance pulling changes out of a hat then why stop at batton pass? the sky is the limit go ahead, get creative. OWN IT.

 

Make 0hko moves leave the target with 1hp so they can be unbanned too (Guillotine, etc). the name wont match because it wouldn't 0hko anymore but neither does batton match its name anymore becuase it doesnt pass anything anymore. who cares, 0hko moves would now become balanced and could be unbanned too, right? :))))

 

Yeah, all those ideas are just as ridiculous as the meme change you guys actually implemented.

 

Note: Before you say that any of those things are different to the baton pass changes, let me tell you they are not. And I will use your very own words to prove it: in my proposed changes, "these moves could already do those things, vanilla mechanics.  Nothing custom was added to them, the only thing that happened was some pieces of them were removed." Solid logic bro :))))))

Edited by iJulian
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8 minutes ago, Gunthug said:

baton pass should have just been flat banned, every single competitive pokemon gen has tried their own foolish method to "nerf" the move out of uncompetitiveness and it's failed every time. 

Deppends on the tier, doubles and lc use it efectively if anything, it could be discussed properly if lc players consider it should be banned or whatever, but randomly pulling changes out of a hat is not the way, that's my whole point.

 

The move went from being viable in two tiers to being trash everywhere. that is not a change that you can hide behing a "balancing" excuse.

Edited by iJulian
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