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September-Movement Discussion Thread


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Normal discussion thread rules apply.

 

This is the second month in a cycle as such we will be using 1.7 to move down and 6.7 to move up.

 

No usage based movements this month, discuss whatever you feel is wrong with the existing tiers. Any final verdicts on anything brought up during the discussion will have a deadline of Saturday around 6 PM CST. Early discussion thread this week due to the awkward timing of dates and I will be busy most of the week

 

OU:

Spoiler

Scizor 16702 29.55%
Ferrothorn 13368 23.65%
Conkeldurr 12830 22.70%
Hydreigon 12186 21.56%
Gengar 10734 18.99%
Salamence 10147 17.95%
Volcarona 9689 17.14%
Kingdra 9060 16.03%
Pelipper 8884 15.72%
Tyranitar 8735 15.46%
Milotic 8670 15.34%
Gyarados 8560 15.15%
Jolteon 8458 14.97%
Togekiss 8419 14.90%
Blissey 7889 13.96%
Cofagrigus 7685 13.60%
Skarmory 7414 13.12%
Excadrill 7337 12.98%
Gliscor 7292 12.90%
Magnezone 7113 12.59%
Swampert 7075 12.52%
Tentacruel 7063 12.50%
Reuniclus 6889 12.19%
Darmanitan 6863 12.14%
Chansey 6552 11.59%
Dragonite 5832 10.32%
Breloom 5755 10.18%
Mienshao 5429 9.61%
Kabutops 4932 8.73%
Cloyster 4272 7.56%
Chandelure 3939 6.97%
Starmie 3497 6.19%
Hippowdon 3440 6.09%
Arcanine 3013 5.33%
Lucario 3013 5.33%
Metagross 2889 5.11%
Porygon2 2142 3.79%
Haxorus 2027 3.59%
Torkoal 1819 3.22%
Jellicent 1695 3.00%
Mamoswine 1651 2.92%
Mandibuzz 1491 2.64%
Umbreon 1488 2.63%
Forretress 1478 2.62%
Bronzong 1438 2.54%
Crobat 1423 2.52%
Weavile 1374 2.43%
Electrode 1305 2.31%
Scrafty 1252 2.22%
Whimsicott 1149 2.03%
Yanmega 1123 1.99%
Zoroark 1111 1.97%
Lanturn 1084 1.92%
Alakazam 1081 1.91%
Aerodactyl 1061 1.88%
Mantine 1042 1.84%
Dusclops 1013 1.79%
Snorlax 969 1.71%
Venusaur 953 1.69%
Weezing 929 1.64%
Ludicolo 928 1.64%
Azumarill 898 1.59%
Dugtrio 893 1.58%
Charizard 848 1.50%
Manectric 847 1.50%
Wobbuffet 843 1.49%
Sigilyph 808 1.43%
Vaporeon 802 1.42%
Marowak 763 1.35%
Eelektross 750 1.33%
Krookodile 746 1.32%
Porygon-Z 664 1.17%
Gallade 637 1.13%
Slowbro 631 1.12%
Donphan 628 1.11%
Flygon 607 1.07%
Swellow 603 1.07%
Electivire 594 1.05%
Dusknoir 590 1.04%
Heracross 567 1.00%

UU:

Spoiler

Crobat 200 46.73%
Mamoswine 99 23.13%
Bronzong 89 20.79%
Eelektross 88 20.56%
Heracross 83 19.39%
Mandibuzz 80 18.69%
Scrafty 76 17.76%
Medicham 76 17.76%
Lanturn 72 16.82%
Forretress 71 16.59%
Snorlax 70 16.36%
Jellicent 60 14.02%
Typhlosion 60 14.02%
Yanmega 56 13.08%
Dusclops 56 13.08%
Donphan 56 13.08%
Porygon2 51 11.92%
Absol 50 11.68%
Venomoth 47 10.98%
Weavile 46 10.75%
Krookodile 44 10.28%
Azumarill 43 10.05%
Mantine 39 9.11%
Magneton 39 9.11%
Alakazam 38 8.88%
Vaporeon 36 8.41%
Flygon 34 7.94%
Venusaur 32 7.48%
Galvantula 31 7.24%
Rhyperior 29 6.78%
Slowbro 28 6.54%
Roserade 28 6.54%
Gigalith 27 6.31%
Zoroark 26 6.07%
Machamp 26 6.07%
Bisharp 24 5.61%
Torkoal 23 5.37%
Sigilyph 22 5.14%
Dugtrio 21 4.91%
Gligar 20 4.67%
Manectric 17 3.97%
Electrode 16 3.74%
Druddigon 15 3.50%
Weezing 14 3.27%
Victreebel 14 3.27%
Umbreon 13 3.04%
Wobbuffet 13 3.04%
Ambipom 13 3.04%
Durant 13 3.04%
Aerodactyl 12 2.80%
Honchkrow 12 2.80%
Froslass 10 2.34%
Clefable 10 2.34%
Whimsicott 9 2.10%
Blastoise 9 2.10%
Pikachu 9 2.10%
Quagsire 9 2.10%
Sceptile 8 1.87%
Miltank 8 1.87%
Mismagius 8 1.87%
Electivire 7 1.64%
Gardevoir 7 1.64%
Nidoqueen 7 1.64%
Hitmonchan 7 1.64%
Gallade 6 1.40%
Lilligant 6 1.40%
Ursaring 6 1.40%
Linoone 6 1.40%
Houndoom 6 1.40%
Vanilluxe 6 1.40%
Altaria 6 1.40%
Ludicolo 5 1.17%
Exeggutor 5 1.17%
Espeon 5 1.17%
Feraligatr 5 1.17%
Aggron 5 1.17%
Omastar 5 1.17%
Poliwrath 5 1.17%
Musharna 5 1.17%
Pinsir 5 1.17%

NU:

Spoiler

Steelix 228 28.08%
Blastoise 200 24.63%
Golbat 195 24.01%
Gallade 194 23.89%
Primeape 150 18.47%
Espeon 139 17.12%
Mismagius 133 16.38%
Charizard 130 16.01%
Slowbro 123 15.15%
Clefable 121 14.90%
Lilligant 117 14.41%
Druddigon 106 13.05%
Houndoom 102 12.56%
Rhydon 102 12.56%
Sceptile 100 12.32%
Durant 90 11.08%
Slowking 87 10.71%
Ambipom 85 10.47%
Swellow 76 9.36%
Gardevoir 68 8.37%
Braviary 66 8.13%
Kangaskhan 64 7.88%
Feraligatr 58 7.14%
Ludicolo 55 6.77%
Omastar 54 6.65%
Vanilluxe 51 6.28%
Roselia 50 6.16%
Nidoqueen 49 6.03%
Altaria 49 6.03%
Cryogonal 49 6.03%
Archeops 48 5.91%
Bibarel 48 5.91%
Aerodactyl 45 5.54%
Sableye 44 5.42%
Magmortar 42 5.17%
Whimsicott 41 5.05%
Scyther 39 4.80%
Electivire 38 4.68%
Hitmontop 37 4.56%
Wobbuffet 35 4.31%
Escavalier 35 4.31%
Throh 34 4.19%
Claydol 34 4.19%
Ferroseed 34 4.19%
Serperior 33 4.06%
Golem 33 4.06%
Linoone 32 3.94%
Ursaring 31 3.82%
Musharna 31 3.82%
Weezing 30 3.69%
Froslass 30 3.69%
Miltank 30 3.69%
Blaziken 28 3.45%
Raichu 27 3.33%
Aggron 26 3.20%
Dusknoir 25 3.08%
Accelgor 25 3.08%
Sneasel 25 3.08%
Crawdaunt 23 2.83%
Hitmonchan 22 2.71%
Poliwrath 20 2.46%
Ninetales 19 2.34%
Lickilicky 17 2.09%
Hariyama 17 2.09%
Probopass 17 2.09%
Stunfisk 16 1.97%
Golurk 16 1.97%
Crustle 16 1.97%
Munchlax 16 1.97%
Pikachu 15 1.85%
Bouffalant 15 1.85%
Zebstrika 15 1.85%
Quagsire 14 1.72%
Samurott 14 1.72%
Lapras 14 1.72%
Hypno 14 1.72%
Flareon 14 1.72%
Sandslash 13 1.60%
Sawsbuck 13 1.60%
Nidoking 13 1.60%
Emboar 13 1.60%
Audino 13 1.60%
Haunter 13 1.60%
Carracosta 11 1.35%
Sawk 11 1.35%
Ampharos 10 1.23%
Piloswine 10 1.23%
Smeargle 10 1.23%
Slaking 10 1.23%
Amoonguss 10 1.23%
Cradily 10 1.23%
Hitmonlee 10 1.23%
Persian 10 1.23%
Gorebyss 9 1.11%
Alomomola 9 1.11%
Cinccino 9 1.11%
Noctowl 9 1.11%

Doubles:

Spoiler

Hitmontop 120 26.79%
Salamence 113 25.22%
Gengar 95 21.21%
Hydreigon 93 20.76%
Togekiss 88 19.64%
Gyarados 84 18.75%
Metagross 73 16.29%
Volcarona 71 15.85%
Scizor 65 14.51%
Torkoal 60 13.39%
Tyranitar 60 13.39%
Ferrothorn 59 13.17%
Porygon2 59 13.17%
Conkeldurr 53 11.83%
Pelipper 53 11.83%
Blastoise 51 11.38%
Excadrill 50 11.16%
Mienshao 48 10.71%
Arcanine 44 9.82%
Reuniclus 44 9.82%
Jolteon 42 9.38%
Typhlosion 38 8.48%
Kingdra 37 8.26%
Lilligant 33 7.37%
Manectric 33 7.37%
Jellicent 32 7.14%
Marowak 32 7.14%
Darmanitan 28 6.25%
Hariyama 26 5.80%
Snorlax 26 5.80%
Bisharp 25 5.58%
Milotic 25 5.58%
Crobat 24 5.36%
Magnezone 24 5.36%
Amoonguss 23 5.13%
Swampert 22 4.91%
Golduck 20 4.46%
Chandelure 19 4.24%
Eelektross 19 4.24%
Lucario 18 4.02%
Ambipom 17 3.79%
Electrode 16 3.57%
Gliscor 16 3.57%
Alakazam 15 3.35%
Breloom 15 3.35%
Rhyperior 15 3.35%
Blissey 14 3.13%
Bronzong 14 3.13%
Ludicolo 14 3.13%
Seismitoad 14 3.13%
Starmie 14 3.13%
Tentacruel 14 3.13%
Venusaur 14 3.13%
Dragonite 13 2.90%
Kabutops 13 2.90%
Raichu 13 2.90%
Hippowdon 12 2.68%
Beheeyem 11 2.46%
Dusclops 11 2.46%
Krookodile 11 2.46%
Mamoswine 11 2.46%
Medicham 11 2.46%
Skarmory 11 2.46%
Electivire 10 2.23%
Exeggutor 10 2.23%
Gallade 10 2.23%
Haxorus 10 2.23%
Smeargle 10 2.23%
Umbreon 10 2.23%
Vanilluxe 10 2.23%
Chansey 9 2.01%
Cofagrigus 9 2.01%
Lanturn 9 2.01%
Serperior 9 2.01%
Sigilyph 9 2.01%
Slowbro 9 2.01%
Slowking 9 2.01%
Weavile 9 2.01%
Cloyster 8 1.79%
Gigalith 8 1.79%
Machamp 8 1.79%
Sceptile 7 1.56%
Slaking 7 1.56%
Whimsicott 7 1.56%
Wobbuffet 7 1.56%
Charizard 6 1.34%
Electabuzz 6 1.34%
Gardevoir 6 1.34%
Lapras 6 1.34%
Porygon-Z 6 1.34%
Azumarill 5 1.12%
Blaziken 5 1.12%
Floatzel 5 1.12%
Froslass 5 1.12%
Jynx 5 1.12%
Mandibuzz 5 1.12%
Victreebel 5 1.12%
Yanmega 5 1.12%
Zoroark 5 1.12%

LC:

Spoiler

Misdreavus 398 65.89%
Mienfoo 385 63.74%
Ferroseed 261 43.21%
Vullaby 259 42.88%
Porygon 195 32.28%
Clamperl 180 29.80%
Onix 141 23.34%
Timburr 122 20.20%
Chinchou 116 19.21%
Grimer 114 18.87%
Munchlax 89 14.74%
Diglett 88 14.57%
Tentacool 77 12.75%
Bronzor 75 12.42%
Staryu 58 9.60%
Gastly 51 8.44%
Abra 49 8.11%
Elekid 44 7.28%
Dwebble 43 7.12%
Larvesta 41 6.79%
Ponyta 41 6.79%
Cottonee 40 6.62%
Magnemite 37 6.13%
Frillish 32 5.30%
Pawniard 31 5.13%
Krabby 28 4.64%
Taillow 28 4.64%
Koffing 27 4.47%
Meowth 26 4.30%
Axew 26 4.30%
Shellder 25 4.14%
Yamask 25 4.14%
Voltorb 21 3.48%
Tirtouga 19 3.15%
Slowpoke 18 2.98%
Magby 18 2.98%
Numel 16 2.65%
Sandile 16 2.65%
Drilbur 13 2.15%
Squirtle 12 1.99%
Zorua 12 1.99%
Wynaut 11 1.82%
Archen 11 1.82%
Drifloon 11 1.82%
Rufflet 11 1.82%
Venonat 11 1.82%
Wooper 11 1.82%
Duskull 9 1.49%
Hippopotas 9 1.49%
Darumaka 8 1.32%
Snivy 8 1.32%
Zubat 8 1.32%
Ekans 7 1.16%
Omanyte 7 1.16%
Sandshrew 7 1.16%

 

Link to comment
5 hours ago, razimove said:

What other option is there, since they dont want to ban misd?

It's important to understand why Misdreavus has such high usage before considering banning it.

 

Misdreavus is extremely good, but it's not the only pokemon incredible in LC. Usage shows that Misdreavus has currently 65.89% usage and Mienfoo is right below with 63.74% usage. Misdreavus has great stats, typing and movepool that make it a huge threat, but all these amazing traits, that makes Misdreavus so good, also makes it the indispensable fighting resistance LC needs to check Mienfoo. If Misdreavus gets banned, what do we have to handle Mienfoo? As the 10th most used LC pokemon with 18.87% usage, Grimer would be the next fighting resistance in the tier, followed by Tentacool as the 13th most used LC pokemon with 12.75% usage. Sadly, U-Turn Mienfoo into Diglett is the end of both Grimer and Tentacool. If Misdreavus wasn't around, Gastly, Frillish, Koffing and Yamask would probably become more common checks to Mienfoo compared to now. However, stuff like Abra, Larvesta and Trubbish would be in the exact same situation as Tentacool and Grimer, preys for Diglett. What I'm pretty much saying here is that if Diglett wasn't in the tier, Misdreavus would not have such high usage because it wouldn't be as indispensable as it is now. 

 

Mienfoo is also the main answer to most of Misdreavus checks; Porygon (32.28% usage), Munchlax (14.74% usage), Ferroseed and Lileep have serious issues against Mienfoo. For this reason, we end up in a vicious circle where Mienfoo gets checked by Misdreavus, Misdreavus gets checked by Porygon/Munchlax and Porygon/Munchlax get checked by Mienfoo. Vullaby helps break this vicious circle by being decent against both Misdreavus and Mienfoo, but Vullaby is not enough, it's not good enough against Mienfoo for Misdreavus to not be needed and it's not good enough against Misdreavus for Porygon/Munchlax to not be needed as well. If Diglett wasn't in the tier, suddenly we would have an increased number of checks for Mienfoo (the ones previously mentioned) and an increased number of checks for Misdreavus as well (bulky fire types mostly). 

 

Then, there is Clamperl, an entire different problem that benefits greatly from having Diglett in the tier. Diglett helps it by trapping most of its revenge killers and counters. Elekid scarf, Chinchou eviolite and Tentacool eviolite all have issues countering Clamperl when Diglett is around. Diglett is the fastest stealth rock setter and memento user, so it's the ideal allied pokemon for Clamperl; Stealth Rocks ruins the common sturdy pokemon of the LC that would prevent Clamperl from sweeping and using Memento against a trapped target makes it very easy for Clamperl to Shell Smash and sweep. Removing Misdreavus will not help at all, it's one of the few Clamperl revenge killers that do not fear Diglett.

 

Banning Misdreavus would only make LC much worse than it is now.

 

Imo, test banning Diglett is what we need if we want LC to become better and more competitive overall.

 

Edited by gbwead
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4 hours ago, gbwead said:

It's important to understand why Misdreavus has such high usage before considering banning it.

 

Misdreavus is extremely good, but it's not the only pokemon incredible in LC. Usage shows that Misdreavus has currently 65.89% usage and Mienfoo is right below with 63.74% usage. Misdreavus has great stats, typing and movepool that make it a huge threat, but all these amazing traits, that makes Misdreavus so good, also makes it the indispensable fighting resistance LC needs to check Mienfoo. If Misdreavus gets banned, what do we have to handle Mienfoo? As the 10th most used LC pokemon with 18.87% usage, Grimer would be the next fighting resistance in the tier, followed by Tentacool as the 13th most used LC pokemon with 12.75% usage. Sadly, U-Turn Mienfoo into Diglett is the end of both Grimer and Tentacool. If Misdreavus wasn't around, Gastly, Frillish, Koffing and Yamask would probably become more common checks to Mienfoo compared to now. However, stuff like Abra, Larvesta and Trubbish would be in the exact same situation as Tentacool and Grimer, preys for Diglett. What I'm pretty much saying here is that if Diglett wasn't in the tier, Misdreavus would not have such high usage because it wouldn't be as indispensable as it is now. 

 

Mienfoo is also the main answer to most of Misdreavus checks; Porygon (32.28% usage), Munchlax (14.74% usage), Ferroseed and Lileep have serious issues against Mienfoo. For this reason, we end up in a vicious circle where Mienfoo gets checked by Misdreavus, Misdreavus gets checked by Porygon/Munchlax and Porygon/Munchlax get checked by Mienfoo. Vullaby helps break this vicious circle by being decent against both Misdreavus and Mienfoo, but Vullaby is not enough, it's not good enough against Mienfoo for Misdreavus to not be needed and it's not good enough against Misdreavus for Porygon/Munchlax to not be needed as well. If Diglett wasn't in the tier, suddenly we would have an increased number of checks for Mienfoo (the ones previously mentioned) and an increased number of checks for Misdreavus as well (bulky fire types mostly). 

 

Then, there is Clamperl, an entire different problem that benefits greatly from having Diglett in the tier. Diglett helps it by trapping most of its revenge killers and counters. Elekid scarf, Chinchou eviolite and Tentacool eviolite all have issues countering Clamperl when Diglett is around. Diglett is the fastest stealth rock setter and memento user, so it's the ideal allied pokemon for Clamperl; Stealth Rocks ruins the common sturdy pokemon of the LC that would prevent Clamperl from sweeping and using Memento against a trapped target makes it very easy for Clamperl to Shell Smash and sweep. Removing Misdreavus will not help at all, it's one of the few Clamperl revenge killers that do not fear Diglett.

 

Banning Misdreavus would only make LC much worse than it is now.

 

Imo, test banning Diglett is what we need if we want LC to become better and more competitive overall.

 

Tbh this sums it up pretty good, thanks, I'd agree with diglett being tested too. 

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Except we got Team Preview, and Dugtrio poses the same issues in different tiers yet with TP being a thing it was deemed competitive, it is even allowed to take part of the usage rule and therefore keeps dropping to lower tiers. Gbwead's theory makes sense on paper but can be considered biased since he doesn't call for a test ban of Dugtrio as well.

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53 minutes ago, Laz said:

Except we got Team Preview, and Dugtrio poses the same issues in different tiers yet with TP being a thing it was deemed competitive, it is even allowed to take part of the usage rule and therefore keeps dropping to lower tiers. Gbwead's theory makes sense on paper but can be considered biased since he doesn't call for a test ban of Dugtrio as well.

It was not deemed competitive. It was deemed not banworthy. Huge difference. Also, comparing UU to LC is pretty irrational, they arent even two different tiers they're flat out different metagames. What's "banworthy" in one isn't necessarily banworthy in another, and the comparisons aren't helpful. If what Gb says makes sense on paper, then it's worth testing to see if it makes sense in practice too. None of this "whataboutism"

 

just to add onto this, even though I JUST said comparisons were irrational, I think one thing that really separates diglett in LC from dugtrio is the relative power of STAB eq in a tier with such low HPs. Duggy would be a lot stronger in UU if it could do the job it's supposed to, but often it's attack is underwhelming and it ends up tickling the threats its trying to remove. Diglett on the other hand, seems to be doing just fine at removing what it wants to, and then mementoing into a devastating set up attacker afterwards

Edited by Gunthug
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8 hours ago, Laz said:

Except we got Team Preview, and Dugtrio poses the same issues in different tiers yet with TP being a thing it was deemed competitive, it is even allowed to take part of the usage rule and therefore keeps dropping to lower tiers. Gbwead's theory makes sense on paper but can be considered biased since he doesn't call for a test ban of Dugtrio as well.

If you want to compare Diglett to Dugtrio, let's do it. There are 40 UU mons over the 4.36% cut-off point. There are 28 LC mons over the 4.36% cut-off point. In UU, Dugtrio is the 39th most used pokemon (or the second least used pokemon over the cut-off point) with 4.91% usage. In LC, Diglett is the 12th most used pokemon with 14.57% usage.  Based on that, we can safely assume two things: i) the pokemon pool that competitive players have access to is much wider in UU than in LC, and ii) Diglett is more present in LC than Dugtrio in UU. Therefore, compared to Dugtrio in UU, Diglett is more present in LC where players have less options, so by default Diglett is much more centralizing than Dugtrio.

 

In UU, out of the 40 mons over the 4.36% cut-off point, approximately 22 pokemon attack on the physical side. After Gligar and Mandibuzz (even though Mandibuzz can be played with only Foul Play) Dugtrio with 80 attack base stat has the lowest attack stat. In LC, out of the 28 mons over the 4.36% cut-off point, 16 pokemon attack on the physical side. Diglett has a higher attack stat than Ferroseed, Onix and Bronzor. Diglett also has the same attack stat as Vullaby and Taillow.

 

In UU, out of the 40 mons over 4.36%, 11 mons are straigh up immune to Arena Trap, that's  27.5% of the pokemon pool immune to Arena Trap. In LC, out of the 28 pokemon over 4.36%, 7 mons are immune to Arena Trap, that's exactly 25% of the pokemon pool immune to Arena Trap.

 

In UU, Dugtrio suffers from 4mss much more than Diglett in LC. Curselax makes it want to play a screech + reversal set. Heracross makes it want to run Aeral Ace. Medicham makes it want to hold a Choice Band, even though fake out + bullet punch kills Dugtrio anyways. Out of the 40 UU mons over 4.36% usage, Dugtrio can't even threathen that many: Magneton, Typhlosion, Lanturn and maybe, just maybe Heracross/Snorlax/Galvantula/Roserade. Out of the 28 LC mons over 4.36% usage, Diglett can threathen a good portion of the tier with only one set: Onix, Chinchou, Grimer, Tentacool, Abra, Ponyta, Larvesta and Magnemite. So despite the pokemon pool being smaller in LC compared to UU, Diglett can get rid of more threats. Also, Diglett doesn't need to be played CB or with a Reversal set to deal with the listed mons, it needs 2 or 3 moves only so Diglett can still support the rest of the team with Stealth Rock or Memento.

In UU, Weavile is faster than Dugtrio. In LC, nothing is faster than Diglett.

 

It's also important to mention that Diglett benefits from the free switches provided by Baton Pass, U-Turn and Volt Switch much more than Dugtrio in UU. For starters, Baton Pass is banned in UU, so there is no Baton Pass into a Diglett trap. There is also no Regenerator pokemon spamming U-Turn in UU, so Rocky Helmet which is hardly viable in LC compared to Eviolite or Berry Juice is more effective at preventing U-Turn spam. 

I could go on and on, but I hope at this point it is overwhelmingly clear that Diglett is way more centralising and unhealthy in LC than Dugtrio could ever be in UU and that's why one needs to be test banned and the other is on its way to drop to NU.

 

 

Edited by gbwead
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On 8/26/2019 at 3:07 AM, Munya said:

Donphan 56 13.08%

 

1 hour ago, soyhector said:

Donphan ---> To NU

 

I never understood why it was moved up to UU. And now it has like 0,0000000000000000000000001% usage.

13% not bad usage, have more usage donphan in uu than durant or rhydon in nu.

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18 minutes ago, Umbramol said:

i want to hear some thoughts about mamoswine on UU!! i was one of the first people who supported this change but i get the feeling that tier is a bit too centralised over it. i would like to see other people's opinions about it

I don't think there was any UU tournaments this month. The usage collected comes only from the 4 CC of August it seems. We really don't have much to go on, so it's difficult to get an idea of what's going on in UU. For what it is worth, both Mamoswine and Bronzong have dropped in usage this month, so it's encouraging imo.

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8 hours ago, Umbramol said:

i want to hear some thoughts about mamoswine on UU!! i was one of the first people who supported this change but i get the feeling that tier is a bit too centralised over it. i would like to see other people's opinions about it

yes, it's a centralizing poke, but i don't complain about that because if its moved to OU i would have to change some teambuildings for both tiers that are working good for me :v

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22 hours ago, soyhector said:

I never understood why it was moved up to UU. And now it has like 0,0000000000000000000000001% usage.

im fine with donphan in uu

 

20 hours ago, soyhector said:

?? lol, I have never seen anyone using donphan on uu.

my main team is using it and it did splendid there

 

11 hours ago, Umbramol said:

i want to hear some thoughts about mamoswine on UU!! i was one of the first people who supported this change but i get the feeling that tier is a bit too centralised over it. i would like to see other people's opinions about it

mamo is a existing threat in uu

tbh it sucks to consider some mons while team building but u have no choice cuz mamo is there

on the other hand there are some mons they can face mamo and handle it well like bronzong or slowbro or just take it down with brute force

at the end i think it can stay here in uu

Edited by BlizzardGG
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On 8/29/2019 at 2:28 AM, BlizzardGG said:

im fine with donphan in uu

 

my main team is using it and it did splendid there

 

mamo is a existing threat in uu

tbh it sucks to consider some mons while team building but u have no choice cuz mamo is there

on the other hand there are some mons they can face mamo and handle it well like bronzong or slowbro or just take it down with brute force

at the end i think it can stay here in uu

Your definition of handling is pretty different from most. Slowbro isnt terrible but calc life orb and cband EQ on him, keep him healthy at all points for him to do anything. Then, consider bronzong, a mon with no self regen, always getting chipped for free everytime mamoswine goes in and button smash icicle crash, or even superpower if they are running that over rocks. Or even endeavor although way more niche I'd argue.

 

Edited by razimove
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3 hours ago, pachima said:

Can we ban Wobbuffet from NU? It has access to tickle now, which makes it able to trap and future pursuit the target much easier.

Don't worry Pachima. If Wobbuffet is played next month as much as it was played this month, it will vanish from the NU pokedex and fall into Untiered. That's like a ban, right?

 

edit: Also, Butler will love having Pursuit users viable again.

Edited by gbwead
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