Aard

You have to beat it a bunch of times in a row to even get to that reward state and the elite 4 takes around 20-25 minutes (16:30 is my fastest, 18 something after update) with the same bp reward and an extra 80k tacked on. Sure, there is healing items, but overall its just better money with no reset on prizes if your winstreak is destroyed. Someone could probably speedrun the battle frontier in 10 minutes or something but it still wouldn't match up with the 20 minute elite 4. Then one unlucky crit there and it takes a few hours to build the reward back up. Gyms are even lower risk than the elite 4 and only take 20-25 minutes per region for 70-90k. I'm sure its possible to get kanto and Hoenn together sub 35 but I've only gotten sub 40 so far. Unova is 35-45 but no one does Unova or at least the last 3 gyms because the pathing to the leaders sucks. Tack mirimoto onto kanto and hoenn and that's ~180k in 40-50 minutes which I don't think really lines up with the work needed to do battle frontier well. Its only once per day, but still. Its the winstreak that is hard to maintain and why I think it needs more value.

They had hidden abilities before. Now, the biggest different is focus sashes and moves like foul play working. Overall, you need a stealth rock user and at the end it probably takes 2 more minutes and a couple of revives more. Around 10k more would be nice and make sense but I doubt it will happen. If anyone needs to be complaining its the lvl 100 battle frontier people. Ridiculous that only gives 2k battle points when the winstreak consistency isn't the easiest thing to master and it takes 15-20 minutes per run. Should give like 50k too.

https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Critical_hit Look at the chart. Pokemmo switched from gen 5 to gen 7 at some point where +3 is 100% crit chance.

In 30k encounters you have a 63.2% chance of running into at least one shiny or with donator a 66.7% chance of running into at least one shiny. If you don't in the next 30k encounters the chance is the same, no one implied otherwise.

After 30 minutes and ~250 pidgeys seen its not too high. (29999/30000)^250 = 99.17% no shiny or if you have donator (299989/300000)^250 = 99.08% no shiny. On average you would need a lot more than 30 minutes. After 100 hours of using sweet scent over and over your chances with are pretty good. (29999/30000)^50000 = 18.89% chance of no shiny (299989/300000)^50000 = 15.99% chance no shiny

Don't know what they have on the second pass, but on the final pass this guide is helpful: Some of the pokes end up having focus sashes now, but mostly accurate. Eventually you are going to want a baton pass strategy.

That is a problem with a lack of team preview and you can make the same argument about anything that can sweep. People don't have more than a couple of cloyster counters/checks or a couple of reuniclus counters/checks or a couple of volcarona counters/checks. If any are revealed late and all the counters dead then a sweep is inevitable with no counter-play options left. I agree its a problem and there's a reason it was changed in the handhelds, but it really has absolutely nothing to do with conkeldurr. The way to deal with it if you have problems with it is to think about why the opponent is putting pressure on certain pokes of yours and try to deciper their team comp. It ends up being much more threatening when you think their last poke is one thing then it ends up being something similar but different enough to sweep you. Anyway, that's just the game right now. Banning pokes won't solve that aspect.

Hey, for some reason my comments are not appearing so for now I'll assume its a glitch rather than censorship. Anyway, what I said was basically that you don't need to be a pro to beat the elite 4, and if you run all three regions you will never have all three on cooldown at the same time. Very Viable!

Come on people. We all agreed to play a game with microtransactions. Quit complaining that they reign supreme. That's how its supposed to work. The solution to this if you want it implemented is to suggest that anyone who makes a tournament can only pay reward points or have donator status to make it.

For the fast one, I could beat the elite four 6 times in 180 minutes, have about 400k in cash +300k from the 12k bp, so 700k. That's 30 rare candies plus whatever I got xp I got from exp share in the elite 4 which is about 25000 per trip so ~150000 for six trips. Why is this cave thing faster even with hordes? Seems slower to me. I'm pretty sure after ev training and 6 elite four trips I'll get whatever up to lvl 70 so how fast the growth is doesn't matter much. Just all pokes take 30 minutes of ev training plus ~3 hours of elite 4 grinding.

You sniped that one. I messed up the calc and deleted it within a minute. If you put a flame orb in on the damage calc site it doesn't auto burn for guts even though it says facade is 140 bp. Anyway, all those calcs are wrong and I wrote a new comment. Facade does make it worse, I think stuff still walls it and either thunderpunch or ice punch. And of course confagrgus and eviolite dusclops are always there as hard walls.

Facade is interesting, I hadnt really looked at that much. Skarmory walls that set and can brave bird back so its not just chandelure that walls it. Also, if gyarados is full defensive it walls. 252+ Atk Guts Conkeldurr Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 121-144 (36.2 - 43.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO -1 252+ Atk Guts Conkeldurr Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gyarados: 148-175 (37.5 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO Also, Jellicent walls that set. And with Gliscor, the offensive sword dance set 1hko's kills if its switch into something that's not ice punch or bulk up. 252+ Atk Flying Gem Gliscor Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Conkeldurr: 432-510 (104.3 - 123.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Thank you. Orange's original Machamp post was propaganda designed to sway the argument over to the proban side without giving any valid reasoning and it caused people to debate for 20 posts as if conk was already uber. Trickery like that is unfortunate but hopefully now we all know better. Anyway I have two reasons for not wanting it banned: 1) No one I've seen has given a good answer to why conkeldurr is broken despite its multiple checks that only fail to wall it because of one uncommon move. Cores like Gliscor and Reuniculus only fail to wall conks with the specific set of payback and ice punch. This is not a common set and even if it does appear conk still has to outpredict to win since it is slower than most switches that come in. Many combinations of similar pokes can be put up to wall conk in this manner and combos like this have many other uses besides just walling conk. 2) The update has only been out for two weeks and the meta has not had time to settle especially now that sheer force is disabled. I don't see proof that conk is so broken that it needs to be quickbanned therefore meaning it should be left in for at least a couple of months until people have an opportunity to learn the meta better.

I just told you why drain punch is the superior option against walls. Beating the walls and still being near full health is a lot better than being hurt. Machamp can't go in and bulk up, beat the wall, then still have enough health to do things later. Conkeldurr can beat walls with drain punch and bulk up and still have plenty of health for later. You said Machamp is just as good at stallbreaking as conkeldurr when its clearly not. I wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt thinking "maybe he just forgot about drain punch" but after your response its clear to me you made the machamp comment with an agenda in mind rather than facts. I hate stall probably as much as you hate conkeldurr, but if there was a chansey suspect I wouldn't sit there and claim its fine to ban it because audino will fill its vacancy. Beyond being a bad argument its just not true.

Choice specs: Ice beam Shadow ball Hidden power (look at whatever tier you want to use it in and pick the best one) Frost breath (or if you have no other heal bell user you can stick it on but you have to know how to predict so you don't lock yourself into a heal bell in a bad situation)

Drain punch is on pretty much every conkeldurr set. Saying "The difference with Conk was just the fact how effortlessly it could pick up the sweepers with Mach Punch" while neglecting to mention drain punch at all is flat out lying by omission. A 40 power priority to a 60 power priority move is not the main difference between Mamchamp and Conkeldurr. And now claiming drain punch isn't useful in wallbreaking. Let's look at two of the most common stall pokes: 252+ Atk Guts Conkeldurr Drain Punch vs. 244 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 564-666 (80.3 - 94.8%) (80.3 - 94.8% recovered) -- guaranteed 2HKO 252+ Atk Guts Conkeldurr Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 254-302 (72.1 - 85.7%) (36.1 - 43% recovered) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery The recovery is important and its actually more powerful than a machamp dynamic punch. After a seismic toss or possible rocky helmet iron barbs damage machamp is half dead. Ferrothorn in particular is a better matchup with conkeldurr. 252+ Atk Machamp Dynamic Punch vs. 244 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 474-560 (67.5 - 79.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO 252+ Atk Machamp Dynamic Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 216-254 (61.3 - 72.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO You're the one with the viability ranking thread so you had to know this. I doubt its an ignorance problem so I can't help but wonder if you have other reasons for making statements that don't follow the basis of any sort of calc. The whole structure of arguing "this poke will just be replaced by this poke" isn't usually accepted in suspect discussion anyway so we will see if you get away on clout.

Why, why, why is this left up for a day without getting torn to pieces? You fail to mention the most important difference: Machamp doesn't learn drain punch. Because of that it doesn't get any recovery meaning the flame orb guts set is worse than the no guard dynamic punch, stone edge set. If guts is run it would probably need leftovers to work and bulk up is shaky. They just aren't the same poke at all beyond typing. Still interesting stall gets a major, major buff with the update and before the meta is even in play for a month people want to ban the most effective stallbreaker. Just bad form. Let the meta settle.

Not hearing from you is troubling. I have screenshots of the deal so get in touch with me soon. Glad I tried this on something not that valuable before sending you my comps.

I agree with that, but more than that it allows for switch timing and teamcomps you otherwise don't have access to. It opens up a few possibilities if after all your checks are dead you still have a prediction based resource like this.

The beauty of it is if they know half your set, that you are scarfed but not that you carry destiny bond, then you win almost every time since they will attack because they are worried about the trick. A good player will see a gengar switch into volcarona on a quiver dance as a scarf and expect trick therefore locking into an attack or switching depending on the state of the game. Then just destiny bond or switch yourself. Beat the best players in this situation almost every time with this set until they know it. Seems good. I'm not saying this is the only set, just my favorite and it is certainly viable.

This is the type of thing that's really annoying. A choice locked destiny bond is only bad depending on when you reveal it. If something has set up that you are usually lost to even with a scarf like volcarona, a fast destiny bond is the only way to take it down. Then if they know your set, it becomes a prediction war on if you will trick on another quiver dance or destiny bond on an attack. Reading what the opponent is going to do isn't luck. Your opponent is not a random number generator. What is a random number generator is if focus blast will hit. I can control rock paper scissors into my favor, I can't control a dice roll. Its just a question of if a player can get something like the destiny bond prediction above 70%. I say they can since with two players of equal skill one knows the set and the other doesn't. With scizor the goal is to get out alive or take it down with you. Both players have to think about the possible options and the result of who wins it is whoever plays better. Hidden power fire is too situational and will just lose once gengar is low enough to be bullet punched to death. All it does is create the 50/50 of switching or dying like destiny bond for one mon and hit ferrothorn. Hidden power ice is more useful because of the kos it gets on dragonite, salamence, flygon, and hurt haxorus. Thunderbolt is useful for dragon dance gyarados, skarmory, and other waters. Hidden power fire just doesn't have the same utility as any of these moves. Also, not to sure about that ttar calc you did 252 SpA Gengar Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 352-416 (87.1 - 102.9%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock 252 SpA Choice Specs Gengar Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 524-620 (129.7 - 153.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO And if someone is crazy enough to run a full spdef set it doesn't really work in this specific situation with pursuit since you need the attack on a choice band to actually 1hko the gengar. 252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Pursuit vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 336-396 (104.6 - 123.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Focus blast on gengar is overrated. Its nice on switches since a miss isn't dead lost, but a lot of times it just needs to hit and doesn't. Don't appreciate 70/30's against tyranitar and it still loses to scizor and cb snorlax. Predicting the pursuit trap or bluffing focus blast on tyranitar is easier. What to do is to get a choice scarf or specs (I like scarf better), then give it this moveset: Shadow ball Hidden power ice/tunderbolt Trick Destiny Bond Can cripple walls, outspeed and ko dragon dancers, and have make pursuit think if they switch in on a destiny bond. You have ot predict well to use it. It goes well if you do but can go really badly if you mess up. But yeah, destiny bond and trick are both much more powerful moves than giga drain or psychic.

Is my meowth almost leveled? Check your whispers more so I don't have to bump the thread every time I want an update.

Yeah, I'd agree two thirds of my gameplay is literally taking a break while the animation finishes to do something else. I used to do productive things during the downtime like learn things and do coursework, but now I've matured and mainly argue with people on the forums during the animation black hole. If the animations were shorter I don't even think I'd have a forum account.

The focus sash does not disappear even if you use it in wild pokemon battles in gen 4. And plenty of teams don't use focus sashes and have no outflux of bp. It doesn't make sense that one item arbitrarily is comsumable when all of the others are not. Yeah, I can imagine if none of the bp items were consumable. The game would be exactly the same but focus sashes would behave like everything else. Its not good design to have the 6 most comon pvp items be permanent and nonconsumable then arbitrarily make the 7th most common a consumable then go back to nonconsumable for most of the others. PVP mystery boxes, which are a really good idea, by themselves completely solve the problem of bp devaluing over time if that were a thing. It isn't a thing currently because of the influx of new players wanting to get into comp and a limited amount of people farming the items. This isn't some elaborately crafted economic setup that geniuses came up with, its just following one rule of how the game functions to the death of common sense. Its actually a really similar course of logic to the battle timer damage fiasco. Also, if you guys had put thought into it you would've checked the price of balloons. I get the idea of money sinks, I don't see why 1 out of the 10 most common pvp items has to be a money sink while the rest are permanent purchases.