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Aard

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  1. Haze bypasses subs though. Spdef mantine is sufficient for beating togekiss unless you have luck worse than that of being crit and evne then you can see it going south after 5 or 6 flinches and switch.
  2. I'll do the math right this time. ((.6)(.95))^9 = 0.64% chance Chance of getting two crits in a row with gen7 mechanics (1/24)^2 = 0.173% chance So about 3 times more likely than getting two crits in a row. Any situation that happens under 5% of the time isn't expected or relevant unless there's enough turns for it to become relevant which togekiss only has so much air slash pp so there's not. Ban discussion should be better than people sitting around a fire and telling ghost stories of when togekiss flinched them 9 times in a row.
  3. Yeah, I don't know why I forgot to put serene grace in that calc. Saw it a few minutes after. Oops. Just makes the point better anyway. Scizor is interesting because it can superpower if it thinks togekiss will roost and bullet punch from 70% if it predicts airslash. It doesnt care that much if togekiss nasty plots or subs on the switch. 252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Togekiss: 64-76 (33.3 - 39.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock 252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Togekiss: 88-105 (45.8 - 54.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock 252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Togekiss: 88-105 (55 - 65.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock While roosting: 252+ Atk Choice Band Scizor Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Togekiss: 170-200 (88.5 - 104.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock 0 SpA Togekiss Air Slash vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Scizor: 60-72 (33.8 - 40.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO +2 0 SpA Togekiss Air Slash vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Scizor: 118-141 (66.6 - 79.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO +2 252 SpA Togekiss Air Slash vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Scizor: 145-172 (81.9 - 97.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO From my experience, Scizor, scarfzone, and one fighting and fire resist is enough to deal with togekiss and isn't unreasonably built just for togekiss. So many common things aren't true counters but have the ability to beat down togekiss and make the game into something where togekiss has to pick the right move multiple times. It is not necessary to run lanturn, spdef dragonite, or whatever else is concocted in the scouting lab. Just build a normal team with normal type coverage and more often than not you'll have enough things to switch into togekiss's moves to have a really good shot at killing it.
  4. Out of all the opinions that people can reasonably differ on, you pick the one thing that is hard fact. (4/10)^2= .16% no flinch. Its actually hax every 2 turns in a row a flinch doesn't occur. Three was to be generous since a 6.4% chance of no flinch occurring means the togekiss got haxxed hard. Togekiss very fairly punishes slower stally mons and also very fairly will never flinch something faster.
  5. Another offensive threat that's easy to beat with prediction but hard to beat with scouting up for ban discussion? Who would've thought. The real issue is that there is a divide in how people to play the game. Some people build up a pool of teams that are really good against one strategy but weak to others and prefer to do most of the damage by relentlessly scouting opponents. Others want to build a team that covers every strategy reasonably and then win through making better reads than the opponent. Togekiss puts a wrench in the first strategy because it has to be outplayed in the battle instead of before the battle. Predicting with a togekiss is harder than it looks, especially the people claiming the scarf set is the best set. Its not. The nasty plot set can be much more forcing especially with Togekiss's biggest asset being able to break stall. By the way, leaving a stall poke in on togekiss and getting flinched is not hax, it would be hax after 3 turns if no flinch occurs. I'm not just against banning all offensive things either. Honchkrow was a good example of when an offensive flying threat gets too powerful for a tier. Its moves did inconsistent damage because of crits so nothing could reliably live 2 of its attacks, it could checkmate half the tier with pursuit, and it had a priority move so even good switches on one turn wouldn't actually be good the next turn unless resistant to dark. Togekiss has none of those issues. If you beat it on a switch it will have to switch next turn or take significant damage. Many things can switch in on it too, just any randomly assembled team will probably have at least 2 or 3 ways to beat it. The best thing togekiss has is a variety of movesets that accomplish different things which means people trying to obsessively scout it will get destroyed if the person they are scouting has 2 or 3 different togekisses they switch between. The thing is with any normally constructed team those sets can be revealed ingame and dealt with without much issue. Its not about its speed and power, its not about its bulk, its not even about its flinchax. Its about people not being able to effectively scout it. My advice is to play for a while without trying to creep on your opponent and it will become much easier to deal with.
  6. You can swap out breloom for ferrothorn and have a more offensive grass mon than your current bulky breloom set especially if you put some evs attack. Or you could run a specs jellicent over hippowdon or sigilyph. Or if you want to preserve your sub focus punch set go with a poliwrath over breloom. Some of those may work, some may not, but the point is there's more options here that prevent your team from auto-losing to rain than just completely changing the playstyle. Forfeiting every time a pelliper appears isn't ideal. If you're going to be so bold about being different, you might as well run an unconventional set or dig into the lower tiers to fix the weakness. My opinion on the easiest quick patch is a specs mantine over sigilyph. It plays the same way but allows you to not autolose to every rain team since at least you can bounce around between mantine and your weather setters, and resists now on kingdra and kabutops. You get another fire resist too to help with the darmanitan problem. Also, people will be more likely to thunderbolt a mantine than a sigilyph so you get more free excadrill switches. Last thing is that some gyarados sets that would flat out sweep you at +2 (or +1 if things are hurt) will be completely walled by mantine. Not to mention you'll surprise people and get most of the moves off you want. 252+ Atk Guts Conkeldurr Drain Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mantine: 143-168 (38.2 - 44.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO 252+ SpA Choice Specs Mantine Air Slash vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Conkeldurr: 414-488 (100 - 117.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO 252+ Atk Guts Conkeldurr Drain Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sigilyph: 64-75 (22.4 - 26.3%) -- 14.5% chance to 4HKO 252 SpA Life Orb Sigilyph Air Slash vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Conkeldurr: 385-455 (92.9 - 109.9%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after burn damage Sure, not as good a conk switch in and you only neutral hit scizor/ferro, but not losing to every team with pelliper is again more important. Think the benefits outweights the cons here. Actually, its already a weird set so why not run air slash, surf, ice beam, hp fire? 252+ SpA Choice Specs Mantine Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Ferrothorn: 276-328 (78.4 - 93.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO Yeah, definitely better than the sigilyph on this team. Pointing out the obvious flaw that the whole team is 1hkoed by 1 mon using 1 move must mean I'm new to teambuilding. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and let that response go. Everyone makes flimsy arguments from emotional places every now and then. One of the worst I've ever seen but you probably realize that too by now.
  7. Slightly rain weak. 252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Excadrill in Rain: 528-624 (283.8 - 335.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO 252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Hippowdon: 324-384 (150.6 - 178.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO 252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Tyranitar in Sand: 168-198 (95.4 - 112.5%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO 252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Magnezone in Rain: 205-243 (141.3 - 167.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO 252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Sigilyph in Rain: 225-265 (152 - 179%) -- guaranteed OHKO 252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 184 HP / 0 SpD Breloom in Rain: 140-165 (88.6 - 104.4%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO Don't know why people are pretending the team is all good when it gets outsped and 1hkoed by 1 mon using 1 move. Its hard to have a bigger weakness than that. Some of the people leaving likes are "good" players too so it makes me wonder if the intention is even to help people build better teams. I don't know, something fishy or incompetent here. Really, no one else noticed the most common rain sweeper just steamrolls? And that's not a knock on you jfk, it was a good attempt at a team and does work against other types of teams. Unfortunately, the rain weakness is too much for this team to be viable without a significant rebuild. If you add rain considerations to the next team you build like ferrothorn or spdef milotic, only use 1 sand setter, and give more things defensive ev spreads, then you'll probably have a good team pretty quickly. Anyway, like the creativity from the builder, but hope critique quality from reviewers gets better in the future since jfk should've been told 5 hours earlier his team is outsped and 1hkod by 1 mon using 1 move. That's more useful info than a like on a forum post.
  8. Its for if the heracross thinks it can sword dance after jellicent switches in on a close combat. Psychic is the safer option though and is viable because of roserade/venusaur.
  9. Yeah I'm not sure on that one. I've noticed the damage calculator messing that up a few times now when I stick specs on something it will randomly add a +1. 252+ SpA Choice Specs Jellicent Psychic vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Heracross: 134-158 (86.4 - 101.9%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO after burn damage 252+ SpA Choice Specs Jellicent Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Heracross: 166-196 (107 - 126.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO You still got ko options and psychic is absolutely viable on that set with roserade and crobat around. And hex on defensive jellicent is fine. Just because people aren't countering with the right sets doesn't mean its broken.
  10. Its funny you cared enough about making an ad hominem argument to look through months of tourneys but can't come up with any response about why your worse set is good. So here's this: Also, want to throw out there that specs Jellicent is a viable set people run since it has a wide movepool and good stabs. Just assuming you can set up on any jellicent is wrong. 252+ SpA Choice Specs Jellicent Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Heracross: 166-196 (107 - 126.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO 252+ SpA Choice Specs Jellicent Surf vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Heracross: 100-118 (64.5 - 76.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after burn damage Let's be honest, even a defensive jellicent with limited spatk investment beats heracross unless hera sword dances or night slashes on the switch at which point switching to something like crobat or attacking depending on the predict still rescues the situation. Definitely not setup bait. 60 SpA Jellicent Hex (130 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Heracross: 73-87 (47 - 56.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after burn damage There's just things like that you ignore with almost all of the mons we've talked about and its not worth going through every single one if your response is just going to be retreating to scout mode to create ad hominem attacks. Based on the damage, saying jellicent is setup bait is just false. It would be bad if people not wanting to deal with annoying argumentative techniques resulted in an unjust heracross ban.
  11. I didn't read your post because I just kind of assumed you'd be arguing using the best sets. But I guess I will now. I'm tired of people pretending these facade sets are really good. They're not. You cant use it for the first turn you come in, then you only have 1 more coverage move to use if you want sword dance. Your hornless set just loses to new things like slowbro when you sd on the switch turn. close combat facade night slash sword dance +2 252 Atk Guts Heracross Night Slash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 300-354 (76.1 - 89.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO It doesn't even need a sword dance if it has megahorn. 252 Atk Guts Heracross Megahorn vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 204-240 (100.9 - 118.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO Also just loses to defensive crobat without stone edge if you facade on the switch. 252 Atk Guts Heracross Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Crobat: 140-165 (72.9 - 85.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO 252 Atk Guts Heracross Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Crobat: 200-236 (104.1 - 122.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO close combat megahorn stone edge/night slash sword dance/night slash I do play uu and I'd much rather see a facade set because it shows me I have an easy battle ahead since the heracross is trying to do too much and losing coverage in the process. Even Choice band heracross that tries to predict status and stack damage is better than that weird facade set.
  12. Crobat and yanmega 4x resist both heracross stabs and outspeed on the return for 1hkos. Predicting whether heracross will stab or stone edge is good enough. If you can't do that because you rely on stall instead of predictions just use dusclops or jellicent. If you find out heracross is running night slash over stone edge then just go back to crobat to wall. And we haven't even talked about gligar or weezing yet which both tank even sword dance boosted hits from all stab and coverage moves. The thing about heracross is it can't afford to predict wrong that many times before it runs out of health. If it stone edges on something like a gigalith expecting a switch then its done. If it close combats on a switch to a crobat then it only get a couple more shots to switch out and try again. It doesn't have a priority move to bail it out. There's enough options to stop it unless you predict horribly at which point you deserve to lose. If you want to talk about something offensive thats closer to being unfair, azumarill can just autowin in a lot of a lot of late-game situations with the lack of team preview. Sure, people will say its walled by jellicent and slowbro, but there's actually a set that 1hkos both. Even if there wasn't, thats a lot less answers than heracross has. Still think its fine, but definitely more of a threat than heracross since the person with the heracross has to make the better predictions in order to win while the person with azumarill just has to open up a sweeping lane and bait in a belly drum chance. Once the azu hits the field for the first time its too late.
  13. Scouting is ultimately a handicap for donators to give them a leg up on other players since excess money means more resources to build a greater variety of comp teams. It is essential to keeping high priority customers feeling as if they are also the most skilled of players so they stick with the game longer. Scouting is supposed to be prevalent and painless and it would probably hurt the economy if it wasn't. Don't think this can be changed without drastically changing what the game is intended to be.
  14. Skarmory? Ferrothorn? Weavile/mamoswine? Excadrill? Kingdra? All of those completely destroy a choice locked outrage either by tanking it, outspeeding it, or both. There's a lot more to deal with dragons than what you listed and literally the only relevant change to calcs is on hard neutral stall mons like chansey and milotic and cofag. The change blatantly by design favors stall. Hearing there's going to be no changes is discouraging since the tier is really not in a good place. Hopefully HA's will fix it I guess.
  15. Its something that is only useful to run on stall teams. Running it on an offensive team is bad. I agree with the nerf because there's no megas to tank the full powered move here. Its not like the game is static. Over time, more and more offensive things are nerfed and more and more stall things are buffed. A certain play style is being strangled out. Being told to switch because some people decided to make up their own rules independent of how the game is usually played is just annoying. There's other tiers that are more enjoyable. Blissey is just a worse poke than chansey. They are so similar though that you can really just group them together and get a 32% usage rate which a good deal higher than anything else in the tier. That said, usage has always been a bad argument for if something is broken. I don't see what comparing chansey to an offensive sweeper does except make it look less threatening. Mega sableye was banned and comparing it to some random offensive threat would look the same. And I'm not even arguing for banning chansey. Just pointing out the outrage nerf significantly helps it as well as the lack of fighting types. I'm aware there's many ways of dealing with chansey. That's great. Why nerf one certain playstyle though arbitrarily? Overall, I'm just not sure why choice band dragonite and dragon dance physical salamence are so scary they had to be nerfed into practically being unusable. If someone could give any sort of even half-decent argument for why choice band dragonite with 120 outrage is too powerful for the meta I'd change my opinion. From where I'm sitting its just looks like a desperate attempt to help stall players.
  16. The nerfed knock off too. You've selectively eliminated the most common gen5 ways around it. The whole cofag, milotic, chansey core simply didn't work in gen 5 and that was a good thing. Stall was still really powerful too, just not overbearing. Its not just a mountain. Its an artificially constructed mountain in the middle of nowhere flatlands and its made out of poop. Chansey getting an absurd defense buff was never a good design choice, but when 2 of the 3 best fighting types are missing (3 of the 4 if you count breloom missing its hidden) and physical dragons are nerfed its just dumb. The game is about punching stuff and killing it, not about people going and hiding in mountains for 10 years like they are some wannabe terrorist. Just because you ko it by pp stalling it with a gengar or getting enough air slash flinches with togekiss doesn't mean it was a quality addition to the game.
  17. The ways to deal with it aren't fun. That's the issue. Pokemon are fun to battle with because they well defined strengths and weaknesses. Scizor is popular because its very good at threatening a lot of things but no one thinks its broken because the flow of play is to try to hit it with a fire move. It has a rhythm to it that feels good. If it was living +1 volcarona fiery dances people would feel different even if it could still be beaten by skarmory or togekiss or whatever else. Having to slow the pace of the game down by 10 turns with awkward strategies just to pp stall a chansey with gengar or flinchhax it with togekiss or play this repetitive switch game where my physical mons with neutral attacks can never do above 50% . Yeah, great mon... so good. This is a thread for salt and I just don't get why anyone would be complaining about rock move accuracy when there's this obese pokemon that ruins the pace of the game and is years overdue to get a heart attack and die.
  18. I knew someone would use mienshaso. Mienshao actually only has a 50% chance of winning because of protect. High jump kick is not a reliable way to beat a protect user. And Adamant Lucario? That's ugly. Jolly isn't as good but you probably ran that first and were surprised at how well chansey tanked. 252 Atk Life Orb Lucario Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 307-361 (86.2 - 101.4%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO I can make up things no1 runs too. Sure, in real gen 5 you had keldeo and terrakion, but here if you want a fighting type that outspeeds thing like chandelure and excadrill out of weather you're stuck running this thing jolly. 252+ Atk Choice Band Slaking Giga Impact vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 624-735 (88.7 - 104.5%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO Oh wait, that doesn't even kill even if protect weren't an issue. Obviously some things ko, they just aren't in ou because they aren't very good outside of killing chansey or they have some major weakness like high jump kick. And again, not counting mienmiss. 252 Atk Guts Heracross Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 386-456 (108.4 - 128%) -- guaranteed OHKO The amount chansey limits teambuilding and stalls out otherwise fun games into situations of waiting for slot machine crits just isn't what I signed up for. It a low skill cap mon. Its like teemo in league of legends. Its a trash character with no redeeming qualities that wins on luck. The game in all generations 5-7 would be better without it. Its also why the people at the top of ranked matchmaking for the most part have trouble breaking a 60% winrrate. Stall has a winrrate cap because crit turns pile up over time. You can keep making braindead predictionless moves, but its just not going to work over 60% of the time. Unfortunately, offense in ou is so artificially nerfed where it can't get over 60% wins. Its to the point where stall players now complain about silly offensive things like togekiss. If togekiss is really the most threatening thing to stall then what does that say about the state of the meta? Serene grace nasty plot airslash hax is how a lot of people are forced to deal with stall. Everything else is stacked in favor of stall so much we are down to flinchhax.
  19. Nah, every time they do that the game gets worse. 90 power outrage, milotic and conk with burn mechanics they no business having in gen 5, eviolite chansey that can't be 1hkod by anything because terrakion is missing. Just use stone edge machamp if you want your rock moves to hit. Honestly, how many of you knew that conkeldurr can't 1hko chansey? Don't even get me started on all the things wrong with that mon. Worst decision gamefreak ever made was giving that thing an eviolite
  20. This was a well thought out response and technically its true that multiple factors are in play. I just don't see the demand for rp items that are constantly available and wanted like move ocarinas increasing so much that it triples their price or pokeyen inflation tripling the price of any non-rp items even with ridiculous new catch rate mechanics. This was not as well thought out of a response. Full of anecdotal evidence and not understanding the difference between rate and raw amount. If the playerbase doubled but donations are only 1.5x what they were, the donation rate decreased. It doesn't matter if the amount of people donating increased or if you know people who dropped $1k. Limited vanities aren't anything new. Is it possible people just now caught on after years of them? Maybe, but why now and not before? Your strategy only worked before because the playerbase drastically increased and no new players had all the previous vanities. Good luck finding another place as big as China or another market as big as Android to expand to and having your money double. All the players who want this years vanities have them and next year that will still be the case unless the game grows. You probably just lost a bunch of money and it worries me you see it as a safe investment rather than a risky one. Its like how people saw bitcoin all over again. And that last sentence: "In my opinion this is not speculation, this is fact". There's a lot that I could say about that that I won't.
  21. I want to see someone spin an argument for rp item prices increasing drastically meaning anything other than a lower percent of players donating. The game demands a certain amount of donations to keep it from looking like its too blatantly pay to win. If ocarinas sold for 10 mil that wouldn't be good. Hope donation rate gets back on track soon. The catch rate decrease and christmas event patched the leak for now but its temporary. Wish whoever has to deal with price setting luck since increasing the rp amount for every item isn't an option since it would make the profitable customers rage. Dungeons that are hard to beat and high skill cap would fix this issue so the good news is I bet we can expect those in ~3 months since it will be more and more necessary to keep the economy in check. To be fair, the devs always come up with something so I bet they will solve this instead of letting the game stagnate. Summing things up, there is a negative correlation between how much people donate and how much non-rp content is released. Above a certain threshold, less donations means more content. Anyway, that's my speculation on it. As long as some cupid arrow heart kiss vanity isn't released that everyone clamors for I predict dungeons by April. Speculation is fun.
  22. Use the money to jumpstart the uu and nu ranked ladders. All it needs to work is a "whoever is top ladder spot at the end of the month gets 10 mil". People will play it, then people will continue to play it if people are playing it since those tiers are more fun than ou anyway, and you solve a problem with your money. It really should be on whoever is in charge to hike the bp reward for a while to get these running, but since that isn't going to happen the community can fix the lack of a ladder issue. Definitely enough uu players now for it to work. Just think, you can either host some tourney people will forget about in a week, or be the man that made a whole new ranked ladder.
  23. Yes, the dev team should focus entirely of catering a 1000 person dinner banquet instead of cooking some scrambled eggs for breakfast. Its one or the other. No breakfast for anyone ever! Seriously though, priority is determined by how hard something is to implement. Implementing a team preview is more difficult than writing a few lines of code that display a counter in a text box. The dev team should know how to do this in a couple of hours max if there's any hope of them knowing how to do a preview, or dungeons, or any of the other stuff people want.
  24. Currently, the only way to figure out when weather is going to end is to spend time scrolling through a battle chat. This is tedious and does not add to the battle experience. Same suggestion goes for screens, trick room, and tailwind.
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